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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: tekebird on November 10, 2008, 10:21:13 AM

Title: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: tekebird on November 10, 2008, 10:21:13 AM: Silver Eagle Bus Manufacturing is now soliciting for a 5 million dollars in investment.

http://www.gobignetwork.com/funding/fundingRequestDetail_144984.aspx
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: tekebird on November 10, 2008, 10:22:07 AM: might be a wise investment for all you Eagle Believers.

Perhaps MCI will belly up and you will be able to ride the wave from the crash
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: cody on November 10, 2008, 10:37:55 AM: I'm not sure if "perhaps" is the correct word, seeing as how MCI filed chapter 11 bankrupsy in september, It seems that finding funding is the theme for the day, detroit is seeking government bailouts, MCI is seeking court protection while they see if they can continue, this all is probably just the tip of the iceberg.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Dreamscape on November 10, 2008, 10:59:12 AM: Hi Doug,

Noticed you changed your avitar description. :-X

Paul
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Jeremy on November 10, 2008, 11:21:11 AM: There was a piece on the evening news here tonight about how the British Government and trade unions are in discussion with the management of the Vauxhall car factories here about how to keep them open when the parent company (ie. General Motors) goes bust. Apparently the Germans are similarly worried about what will happen to their Opel plants.

Jeremy
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: cody on November 10, 2008, 11:41:27 AM: The claim is that we are dangerously close to slipping into a recession, what would constitute 'slipping" lol, I'm kinda inclined to thing we have slopped lol. It seems to be a sad commentary on the ecomomy when a company like MCI slips into the throes of a court system, hopefully they can recover after restructuring, the article says that the move may save then 54 million in interest debt, thats a major chunk of change for crediters to swallow. Eagle seeking funding in this economy shouldn't surprise anyone, I think we can safely say that most companies are reviewing their options and looking for the cheapest money. My dad used to preach that when one company goes down another goes up, to look for the one that heads up, hopefully they can all do well inspite of the economy, anytime a bus related company has problems, all of us in the bus community loose a little, hopefully it's just MCI's airbag leaking and not a ruptured financial air beam lol.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: belfert on November 10, 2008, 11:58:39 AM: Isn't MCI's filing one of those prepackaged filings? It appears they already had new financing lined up and the consent of their major creditors before entering bankruptcy.

Refinancing makes sense these days with interest rates down. In more normal times, companies refinance all the time when interest rates are down.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: coachconverter on November 10, 2008, 02:52:11 PM: I got a peak at their new styling on the Model 15, a 37 footer, and I think everyone will be happier with it's looks. I'm trying to get Craig's okey-dokey to share it, and will when that happens.

Todd
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: VAN on November 10, 2008, 03:14:09 PM: Sad to say not every one ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) 8) :o wOO hOO :o :o :o :o :o

BUT i AM :-*
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: ktmossman on November 12, 2008, 07:24:46 AM: I'm curious as to why the idea that Eagle is seeking more investment is considered a bad thing, especially if they are making the request public. This is a common practice for new businesses, especially those in a manufacturing industry. You get your first round of investment to fund the proof-of-concept. This is actually the hard money to find because you are asking investors to fund an "idea".

Once you have produced your first model, you now know more about a.) the potential market response to your product, and b.) what materials, equipment, etc. will be required in the manufacturing process. So, you now have concrete details to get the "heavy" money needed to ramp up manufacturing. This round of funding is typically far easier because you can produce solid cost figures and much better forecast figures. Thus, the investors have real data on which to make a decision.

What this tells me is that Eagle successfully produced a solid proof-of-concept and got a good enough response in the market that they are ready to move forward to real production operations. The only bad thing is that they are in a hard economy to attract investors. On the other hand, five million dollars is not a big investment for a vehicle manufacturing process.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: HighTechRedneck on November 12, 2008, 07:37:18 AM: Quote from: ktmossman on November 12, 2008, 07:24:46 AM
What this tells me is that Eagle successfully produced a solid proof-of-concept and got a good enough response in the market that they are ready to move forward to real production operations.

Exactly my thoughts. The investment request is actually a very good sign for the future of Silver Eagle Manufacturing.

And they are doing it right. $5M is a reasonable next step with a good chance of finding an investor.

In contrast, Millenium Transit, a company that I had really hoped could restart the RTS line, went out and got a nice large order from NJT almost immediately. It sounded like a very promising start. But then they were unable to get the huge investment backing needed to produce that large order and lost the order.

In my opinion Silver Eagle is doing it right taking their time. Working out all the bugs and building up slowly, one step at a time.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Jeremy on November 12, 2008, 09:07:15 AM: I was thinking about this last night - given how much passion there clearly is amongst Eagle owners, I'm surprised that a syndicate of exisiting Eagle owners hasn't been set up to help fund the production of the new ones. Although everyone keeps referring to Silver Eagle wanting a $5m loan, what they actually said was that they had a number of confirmed orders and needed a rolling programme of $250,000 - $300,000 funding to enable them to build each vehicle.

I've seen pictures of Eagle rallies with dozens of shiney mega-buck Eagles lined up - can't help but think that the Eagle Owners Association (or whatever) could organise 25 owners to put up $10k each to get Silver Eagle going. If what they said is true it should be ~~rusty-iron~~ cast-iron investment for a guarenteed return after only 2 or 3 months (or however long it takes to build one).

Jeremy
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Songman on November 12, 2008, 11:59:27 AM: Jeremy,

There is lots going on behind the scenes at Eagle. Just because it is not plastered all over a website, some people think it isn't true. Silver Eagle is building buses, both the new 25 and the new version of the 15. Don't let anyone tell you differently.

I just met with one of my clients the other day in a totally unrelated business and they are looking for an investor. They have been in business for over 25 years and have several million dollars worth of military contracts. Because of a recent internal reorganization, they do not have all the capital they need to buy supplies at a competitive price to complete the orders. They are looking for an investor or investors to help them with that capital.

As said above, it is not a bad thing. It is a normal business thing. It only becomes a bad thing if misconstrued by a third party with no knowledge of what is going on. Silver Eagle is going to be just fine. You can bet on it. And all of us who have Eagles are already benefiting by them being there.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: rusty on November 12, 2008, 02:00:12 PM: Jeremy Thank you for helping us figure this out but I think it goes a little deeper than that. 25 X 10,000= 250,000 that works if you are building one bus at a time. Silver Eagle has already done that and knows what it take to build a bus. But building buses one at a time is not very efficient. I can see why they are asking for 5 mill.
As for are mega dollar buses I can speak for mine and it's shiny. I have 5000 manhours of my time in it that I didnot have to pay for. That makes it easier to have a nice bus for a lot less money. I know a lot of Eagle owners that have done as I have.
There are Eagle owners that are helping in anyway they can to help Silver Eagle survive and succeed.
Wayne
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Kobbeltvedt on November 12, 2008, 02:25:34 PM: Thank you Wayne and all of the others who are helping to support Silver Eagle Bus! I can imagine that Silver Eagle is doing its best to support you all in return. I hope that Silver Eagle will be around for a long time to come.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Dreamscape on November 12, 2008, 02:32:57 PM: Quote from: Kobbeltvedt on November 12, 2008, 02:25:34 PM
Thank you Wayne and all of the others who are helping to support Silver Eagle Bus! I can imagine that Silver Eagle is doing its best to support you all in return. I hope that Silver Eagle will be around for a long time to come.

Can I hear an Amen? ;)

Paul
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Jeremy on November 12, 2008, 02:47:02 PM: I think perhaps people are misinterpreting my post - I wasn't trying to draw an interpretation either way from Silver Eagle's search for funding, merely to suggest a possible route based on what they themselves had requested, which was $250-300k per vehicle for a series of confirmed orders. Concluding anything beyond this is really just speculation, unless presumably the poster has inside knowledge as some have suggested.

Just to be clear, I really don't have an axe to grind in this discussion - I'm very happy to believe that Silver Eagle are already succeeding and hope they continue to do so and can produce a world class American-built bus.

Jeremy
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: VanTare on November 12, 2008, 03:29:44 PM: I know absolutely nothing about Sliver Eagle Mfg but the owner made one mistake that I can see from being in the manufacturing business for 33 years and that would be believing the City of Brownsville Tx. I know they proably did the same to him as me promises of low intrest loans, low rent and low low taxes . Having dealt with this group for 18 years I packed up 8 years ago moved my operations to Bexar County Tx (San Antonio)if he is successful in getting 5 mil he should call Southwestern Motor Freight and get of Brownsville as fast as possible I did. just a few thoughts from somebody that has been there

David
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: ktmossman on November 13, 2008, 08:31:33 AM: Quote from: VanTare on November 12, 2008, 03:29:44 PM
I know absolutely nothing about Sliver Eagle Mfg but the owner made one mistake that I can see from being in the manufacturing business for 33 years and that would be believing the City of Brownsville Tx. I know they proably did the same to him as me promises of low intrest loans, low rent and low low taxes . Having dealt with this group for 18 years I packed up 8 years ago moved my operations to Bexar County Tx (San Antonio)if he is successful in getting 5 mil he should call Southwestern Motor Freight and get of Brownsville as fast as possible I did. just a few thoughts from somebody that has been there

That's funny.... I was kinda thinking the same thing. Of all the places to put a business in Texas, why the he!! would someone park it in Brownsville? From logistics, to the skilled labor pool, to proximity/accessibility to major transportation hubs for you clients, it just doesn't make sense. They must have been promised some serious coin in tax breaks...
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: SmoothJazz on November 13, 2008, 08:56:12 AM: Ktmossman,

What do you know about Brownsville? They happen to have a very experienced skilled labor pool that actually built Eagle Coaches for 25 years there. They have an airport, all of the major transportation companies and the Port of Brownsville. Brownsville is also situated equally between the east and west coasts, so shipping costs are not much different than if they were anywhere else in Texas. I happen to take offense to your post as it seems as though you might not know anything about Brownsville.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: John316 on November 13, 2008, 09:17:01 AM: Remember guys, we want this board to stay nice and civil. People can have opinions, but don't get offended. No decision is ever bad (to the person). The person who made that decision had a good reason. Please, lets be adults here. ;) ;D

God bless,

John
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Eagle78550 on November 13, 2008, 09:42:36 AM: I agree with smoothjazz..Brownsville is and always will be home to Eagle. I moved to Brownsville back in the 90's only to work for Eagle Coach. When Eagle closed in 96 I never left ..I moved to Harlingen ( which is just up the road ) and was honored to work again at Silver Eagle when Craig fired it up. The Rio Grande Valley has some of the finest people I have ever known. When Craig brought back Eagle the former employees ...some nearing retirement age.... came to the plant and wanted to help ...some still go by the plant to this day just to see what is going on. With NAFTA and the maquiladoros the shipping in and out of the Valley is second to none. I hope and pray on a daily basis that Craig and his family ( and it is a family operation ) succeed to the highest regard. 600+ employees and a coach every 12 hours USA proud....just like back in the day ...anytime Craig or Dan need my help or assistance they know I am just a phone call away.

God Bless the United States of America and God Bless Silver Eagle Bus Mfg !!!
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: luvrbus on November 13, 2008, 10:07:32 AM: Look what you started David kinda like your post on another board when you said you liked your Newell better than the Prevost you have now lol good luck
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: ktmossman on November 13, 2008, 01:15:50 PM: I have nothing against Brownsville (any more than any other place in TX, and less than a few). It is a reasonably nice place (as far as places in TX go). I'm just saying that, if I was going to start a vehicle manufacturing business in TX catering to a nationwide clientele, there would be a good-sized list of locations I would choose first, based on a number of factors.

I have never lived in Brownsville, but we did frequent the area when I had the misfortune of living in TX. :o Whether we were vacationing on South Padre or heading down to CV on a mission trip, or any number of things, we were in the Brownsville area several times a year. I haven't been there in a number of years as I generally avoid TX except to visit my parents and in-laws.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: SmoothJazz on November 13, 2008, 01:25:28 PM: Ktmossman,

I would invite you to come visit Brownsville as it has changed tremendously over the last 10 years. It is one of the fastest growing areas in the nation. The population is 160,000 plus, almost double what it was twenty years ago. It is growing because they have attracted a lot of new businesses to locate here. They currently are building a sports park with a 23 million dollar price tag. This will bring in people by the bus loads for sporting events. If you have not been here for quite some time, then you might not recognize it if you come back. Come visit.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Eagle78550 on November 13, 2008, 01:52:02 PM: Oh I understand now ...it is not Brownsville in particular ...you just dont like Texas in general.
I feel better now......LOL !!!
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: Dreamscape on November 13, 2008, 06:19:06 PM: Hey I live in Texas, and no matter where you go, you are still in Texas! ::)

Paul
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: HighTechRedneck on November 13, 2008, 06:52:11 PM: I used to live in Texas and loved it. I think it was where I felt the most "at home". So even though I'm not there anymore, and I wasn't born there, I still think of Texas as my home state.
Title: Re: new update about Silver Eagle Bus
Post by: ktmossman on November 14, 2008, 08:17:53 AM: You are correct... I dislike Texas. I lived there for over a decade, married a born/bred Texas girl, and both my in-laws (Abilene) and parents (DFW) are there. But I have absolutely NO desire to live there again. I might consider living in San Antonio given adequate employment, because it is such a beautiful city, but even that would take some convincing.

SmoothJazz, I think you made my point. A labor pool of 160K is just not that big considering some of the major cities in TX. The Brownsville airport just doesn't quite measure up to DFW (heck, Love Field might be bigger), Austin, Houston, etc. (not just in size, but in ticket costs, flight availability, etc.) Major trade shows and events are going to be in major metro areas. All of these things would be considerations in where to base a startup business. Not trying to knock Brownsville as a city (I tend to dislike large cities in general, personally), but just basic demographic facts that would influence business decisions.