BCM Community
Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: Geoff on February 12, 2019, 05:44:21 PM
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Last time there was only 3 buses up for bid, now there are 9ea 45 ft. MCI's. I am not involved in this, I only got a flyer in the mail.
The auction will take place Feb. 23, 2019, 10 am. Vallejo, CA
For more information go to:
www.1stcapitolauction.com
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Thanks Geoff,
No details as yet. Only mention of the buses is the brochure that says what you put in the subject.
May check it out in person. I lost the last one I bid on, not that I need another one. lol
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Why are they auctioning them. They are in Vallejo they will get stolen anyway,lOl ;)
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What is the purpose of "DEALER ONLY"? Do they require you to prove?
*Edit* Yes. Dealers License and Sellers Permit.
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Not quite "dealers only". If you are from out of state you can buy a non CARB approved bus by having an out of state ID and Bill of Lading, which also exempts you from paying CA sales tax. If you win a bus, you pay up and drive out the gate-- or haul it out on a trailer if you follow the rules.
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details up. 2003 d4500. no bids. says no minimum, no reserve.
These are from commuter fleet.
Looks CARB compliant.
https://1stcapitolauction.proxibid.com/First-Capitol-Auction/Asset-Seizures-Government-Fleet-Vehicles/event-catalog/156173 (https://1stcapitolauction.proxibid.com/First-Capitol-Auction/Asset-Seizures-Government-Fleet-Vehicles/event-catalog/156173)
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These buses are 15-16 years old (2003), and most of them are retrofitted to current CARB Standards. The ones that aren't are CA Dealer or out of state buyers only.
I'm wondering if the CARB compliant buses have lower engine hours since that is probably when they were rebuilt.
Well, the last three MCI D's that sold at this auction were non-compliant, and went for 8k each.
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What is really surprising is how little interest this auction has generated here. If anyone is at all serious considering this coach for conversion, why nada? That many units going to auction with ZERO reserve and minimum has gotta deliver a super deal or two. These will probably go for more than the last batch as these seem able to be titled as working transport vehicles.
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I'm willing to bet interest in doing a conversion is waning due to the realization that getting insurance is a major hurdle, especially before it is an official conversion. Major then changes to a significant one. Liability insurance not so bad. It's the collision part that is the bugger, especially if financing through other than a personal loan or younger than, say, 35 to 40 without an exemplary driving record, or significant employment history.
Notice how many units show up on Facebook for sale after short ownership of the shell having conversion just started or not.
Then we get into problems on where to park or store it without the ire of local jurisdictions.
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I've got the sickness, I looked at these with an eye towards "what would I build when the kids are grown?, 45 feet would be nice.
I'm not even doBe with the first build yet, and my oldest is 13.
I love my city, it's 1 minimum acre lots by law / ordinance and for the most part we stay out of each other's business. I've been able to convert ours in or next to our driveway with nothing but eagar questions, smiles and honking as they drive by and see it progressing.
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Typically, peeps are here because they already have a bus.
Don't let all the noise on social media distract you, huge percentage of those are penniless enthusiast posers.
And living life large online encourages others to bid against you, and/or string out their authoritative criticisms.
I'm not telling anyone that i'm bidding on the whole set so we can start shooting Gary's bus conversion reality show...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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Could be interesting, those being in Cali. Pretty much a long transport whoever buys them. And you'll have other transpo companies interested. For the right price one of those just might buy the complete set. But they should be very nice buses if not too badly abused. Whether or not a deal is possible won't be clear until the dust settles.
Jim
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I read somewhere that those buses are being replaced by new MCI's with natural gas engines
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2500 miles to get it home or I'd be pretty interested.
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Insurance hurdle is something new to me as mine was titled as an RV when purchased. Clearly, these are presently commercially equipped so it'll require insurance that covers commercial not private use; maybe, there are different classes for type of use such as driving myself, no passengers, very little use during conversion, etc. vs driving parishioners on Sundays or the HS football team to games.
The lure and pull is strong to DIY convert commercial bus to RV but there are so many hurdles including where you park and work on the thing for the required extended duration. Most haven't access to legal/affordable space for storing and working on the project.
Finding and buying a great quality coach that is really good shape, cheap, close, documented, etc. is rare. Transporting these after sale to home can cost a wallet full of bucks but in the overall total spent cost once converted it isn't all that much. It is tough to decide to transport a bus a couple thousand miles even if it's a gem. Unless you live a hour away. LOL
Well, I've decided to check it out. Really hard to know if buyers are interested in purchasing for commercial use, in CA or other states. Actually, draw a blank who's going to bid. If they go really cheap and drive well, I very well may buy one as a rolling storage unit, cheaper than what I'm paying now.
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I read somewhere that those buses are being replaced by new MCI's with natural gas engines
Got my curiosity behind the sale. A few years ago Solano County awarded a new contract to company, National Transit Express, to run the buses
https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-news/solano-news/solano-county/soltrans-chooses-national-express-to-run-buses/ (https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-news/solano-news/solano-county/soltrans-chooses-national-express-to-run-buses/)
The fleet is pictured in their website
https://www.nationalexpresstransit.com/careers/ (https://www.nationalexpresstransit.com/careers/)
Some details on Solano County Transit
https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/Soltrans.html#cite_note-8 (https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/Soltrans.html#cite_note-8)
BINGO! buckle up you e-bus haters. lol
New electric buses replacing these older diesels
https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-news/solano-news/fairfield/solano-agency-gets-10-8m-for-regional-transit-upgrades/ (https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-news/solano-news/fairfield/solano-agency-gets-10-8m-for-regional-transit-upgrades/)
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I have purchased from 1st Capital Auction for over 20 years and only recently are they getting fleet retired parlor buses. All they used to get were city buses and Suburban buses geared for the highway. Now that counties are providing commuter buses, we suddenly have highway buses that have used up their 15 year government subsidies and and are able to buy new buses. These retired buses are well maintained and are better than buying a used charter bus.
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I had a chance to tour the Las Vegas bus maintaince shop on Sunset while we were there a amazing complex,they can replace a engine in the double decker Van Hools in 3 hours and be back in service.lol after being around and watching repairs to the Van Hool I have no desire to own one ;D by the way Vegas has no diesel buses
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All of our busses at the home of Penn State University have been Natural gas for 10 years now.
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Actually, I'll keep an eye on them. Fuel/flight to get it home would be another $1200-$1500. They would have to go for a low price for me to bite just because I've had the worst luck with my first purchase... I'm still recovering. I probably couldn't hang bidding against you guys. :(
I'm not exactly familiar with the CARB compliance. Does this mean they have SCR/DPF? A DPF delete is pretty costly correct?
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Found the actual fleet details for the commuter buses going up for sale; maybe not exactly but pretty close. this list is a couple years old so the listed mileage is now higher.
Understanding CARB rules - may as well have gone to law school - ridiculously complicated. DPF was one of the options for some retrofits but that was for some interim period when new regs went into force that required four strokes to be phased in. At this point i.e. 2019, basically all the two strokes are off the road except those listed as exempted (RV buses being one).
It'll be interesting to see if out of state buyers would bid on these for low usage/backup charter use. It seems unlikely that any commercial operator would want to put these older ones into their fleet.
No offense but to those who cringe at money needed to get a coach home needs to find another hobby. A thousand or two is lunch money in this world where a steering box, a couple fill ups, or a set of tires costs more.
The excitement builds. :P
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These buses are exactly what the hard charging second/third tier casino charter companies love to have.
And anyone else in the cut rate market.
Niagara Falls is full of old commuters that have been tarted up, Vegas must the the same?
As for insulting people, maybe more people need to have more reality in their lives instead of participation medals?
If the flight and fuel to fetch one is a budget buster, stop the bus addiction before you become another "busted bus in a field" broke busnut.
Those DL's need $4800 worth of tires under them on a regular basis. Where's that money coming from?
Ask anyone with a bus for sale how many foolish calls they are getting...
These aren't insults, this is supportive financial advice.
Perhaps we should start billing?
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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Found the actual fleet details for the commuter buses going up for sale; maybe not exactly but pretty close. this list is a couple years old so the listed mileage is now higher.
Understanding CARB rules - may as well have gone to law school - ridiculously complicated. DPF was one of the options for some retrofits but that was for some interim period when new regs went into force that required four strokes to be phased in. At this point i.e. 2019, basically all the two strokes are off the road except those listed as exempted (RV buses being one).
It'll be interesting to see if out of state buyers would bid on these for low usage/backup charter use. It seems unlikely that any commercial operator would want to put these older ones into their fleet.
No offense but to those who cringe at money needed to get a coach home needs to find another hobby. A thousand or two is lunch money in this world where a steering box, a couple fill ups, or a set of tires costs more.
The excitement builds. :P
I know first-hand how it feels to have a bleeding wallet. Everyone's financial situation is different, especially mine as I've alluded to. Some can throw money at a quick conversion and others can work slower as they acquire the funds(after initial purchase ofc). Both can enjoy the hobby equally I believe. Thanks for the info and general advice.
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I went on the 1st Capital website and if you click on the link for proxy bids you'll get individual information on each bus. It seems most of them are CARB retrofitted and still legal to drive in CA, but there are a few that are non CARB compliant. The last auction had three non compliant buses that went for 8k each. So I imagine the 8k buses are likely to be what those non compliant are going to be sold for, but it's an auction and you never know.
However, the CARB compliant buses will undoubtedly go for more money. And yes, there is a big market for 15 year old buses.
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All it takes for a 2004 model to comply with CARB is a PM muffler that is good to 2021 then it has to be replaced with a 2010 model engine
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All it takes for a 2004 model to comply with CARB is a PM muffler that is good to 2021 then it has to be replaced with a 2010 model engine
2021 - pretty short fuse. how many commercial operators would be interested knowing the bus will be worth much less?
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2500 miles to get it home or I'd be pretty interested.
The point (or hope) of owning a coach is to put miles on.
Just do it. :)
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2021 - pretty short fuse. how many commercial operators would be interested knowing the bus will be worth much less?
All kinds of them. These are the last commercial operators that everyone gets warned about. They will run these buses with no maintenance, bailing wire and spit, make their money, then sell what's left over to unsuspecting busnuts as coming out of a commuter fleet only 2 years ago...
Watch for them to re-appear, along with all the others stale dating in 2021, many with barely a change in paint scheme.
A wild time of great deals and broken hearts will be upon us, as 2021 deadline approaches.
Lots of unwary busnuts are going to get taken to the cleaners, buying crap, and lots of good lower tier fleets are not going to get the value they thought was in their oldest equipment.
And the buses will be scattered to dealers across the continent in a desperate attempt to make some money off them.
Those in the know are going to make a few bucks, the rest are going to lose money.
Survival of the fittest, the way it should be...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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I wonder about flood busses. Are they removed from fleets and scrapped or sneaked through?
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CARB is telling you the 14L series 60 is non compliance after 2021 in CA,the buses will need the DD13 engine to comply
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This specific batch of buses are used as intercity county commuters in Solano county. No floods here but plenty of fires and earthquakes. Being a native Nor Cal bus, it'd be highly odd if the body/chassis had any rust type issues. Or much heat/sun/UV related damage either.
These can always driven outside the reach of commy CARB so buyers out of state can drive them as BW says until the wheels fall off
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Auction results.
I attended the auction and checked out the buses being auctioned off. They are in pretty darn good shape, having served duty in Nor Cal Bay Area where weather year round is between 50-90 degrees.
One had keys and was running and sounded fine. The dumbass put the god damn thing in gear and nearly pushed me into the canal. Due to the recent bus incident we had, my wife just lost it thinking I got run over. OK, reverse works. Service records were not in the vehicle but found a daily inspection report dated a couple months ago so these were in recent service and assumed to be roadworthy. Tires were current some less than a year old. No bathrooms in the back so easier to convert. Bays clean and doors really stout and tight. Engines looked fine. Overall, very solid coaches.
Now the best part? They sold for between $5000 and $6500.
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more pics
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auction results
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Don those are S 60 engines they aren't on the list they are 4 stroke?
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Snooze you lose.
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nice profit! 2x+ return in a month from $5,800(auction) to $12,350(ebay)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-MCI-BUS-Motor-Coach-Industries-D4500-Charter-Bus-Commuter-Bus-Tour-Bus/233155431919?hash=item3649258def:g:2WcAAOSwtwVcfeGk (https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-MCI-BUS-Motor-Coach-Industries-D4500-Charter-Bus-Commuter-Bus-Tour-Bus/233155431919?hash=item3649258def:g:2WcAAOSwtwVcfeGk)
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nice profit! 2x+ return in a month from $5,800(auction) to $12,350(ebay)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-MCI-BUS-Motor-Coach-Industries-D4500-Charter-Bus-Commuter-Bus-Tour-Bus/233155431919?hash=item3649258def:g:2WcAAOSwtwVcfeGk (https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-MCI-BUS-Motor-Coach-Industries-D4500-Charter-Bus-Commuter-Bus-Tour-Bus/233155431919?hash=item3649258def:g:2WcAAOSwtwVcfeGk)
When I click on this, I get "This auction ended - here is a similar item" -- it's a 2004 "Perfect condition, MCI D4500 Detroit Series 60". Price $20.000. Your point here is made very well.
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The original posting should appear small at the top of the page showing the result. This might be the same flipper I saw selling them for around $11k a few weeks ago. He sold 2 already and had 2 left.
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I seriously wonder how many of us would really want a coach that long, even if it'll turn as sharp as a 40 footer. Add a toad and stay off all but multi lane major roads?
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I seriously wonder how many of us would really want a coach that long, even if it'll turn as sharp as a 40 footer. Add a toad and stay off all but multi lane major roads?
In looking at various conversions, I've preferred the layouts of 102'' wide over 96'' and 45' over 40'. I'd really like to find a decent 45' when the time is right, but I worry about the accessibility like you've brought up. Can anyone shed light on that aspect with some real-world experience on and off-road?
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I love our 35-foot bus and would not want a 45-foot coach, but lots of high-end Class A motor homes are 45 feet long and they are quite popular. Not sure where they're going with them, but I'd bet that they are at the high-end campgrounds spending lots on camping fees.
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Once & awhile wish our 04 was shorter than 35. But I can tell ya that the ole' girl can fit in 20' max campsites - with an axle against a parking bumper the other end of the bus usually clears the roadway. Not having slide outs is advantageous sometimes too for getting into tight campsites between trees. We like National Forests & parks so the 35' is our Max.
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I have a DL3 45' and occasionally tow a car putting us out to around 65' total length. I definately have to pay attention when towing concerning fuel stops but I primarily stick to truck stops or the like anyway. As far as camping I don't really do state parks anyway, but I find most rv parks are well able to handle us. I often frequent BLM and National Forest areas where there is plenty of room anyway. If I am going into an area I am not familiar with I always check out google maps satellite view ahead of time. I have not found my length of vehicle to be much of a hindrance. Just have to do the due diligence and check it out ahead of time and avoid getting into tight spots.