BCM Community
Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: matzeinusa on April 28, 2021, 11:23:35 PM
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Looking for a donor engine!
Brought my coach to the shop and got the bad news that the heads are toast/cracked and someone put the wrong freeze plugs in years ago.
If anyone has a good engine/rebuilt engine [in or close to Northern California or anywhere in the USA], please let me know.
In case I can't find one, I probably have to bring the bus to the scrapyard. I am trying to avoid it though.
There will be parts on sale if that happens.
Thanks!
Matt
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Wrong freeze plugs years ago explain please ,you should find one from a later model transit bus in Oregon or Washington you probably won"t find one in CA ,Mac paid a 1000 bucks for one in Portland with a V730 transmission you will need to use your cradle though
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Yeah, better get your radar running on this shop, what is this freeze plug comment?
If there's made up bullshit at this point, your pain is far from over...
Go carefully...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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freeze plugs push out and heads crack if frozen. Overheat it bad enough and plugs could also fail if rusty. Your best bet is to just part it out and start over, unless it is,a real nice conversion and/or youve already sunk a lot of money into it.
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They just mentioned that the plugs are not stainless steal and that’s why the are corroded on the inside and outside and you can’t reach them on the forward side of the engine. Have to pull the engine.
But there is coolant leaking into one cylinder = cracked head. Also pressure is pushing out the coolant out of the reservoir.
And one of the cylinders ceased up and the engine doesn’t start when it’s hot…
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They don't have stainless freeze plugs in Detroit's high level of PH balance rusts the freeze plugs out from corrosion from wrong anti freeze or no maintaince your engine is not original for the year model so it has been changed over to the newer style 8v71
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Hey Matt what shop up north said this? You can PM me if you don't want to say.
Dave
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Matt -
Where in NoCA are you located? Might help if you'd upgrade your profile to include a signature line similar to mine and others that lists your coach and your home base city/state.
Second, you can't just use any old 8V71, it's got to be one out of a GMC coach, as they're left hand rotation compared to a truck engine. A transit with a V-drive automatic will also have a LH engine (except for the few transits out there with a Series 50 four cylinder.) A truck engine will give you four speeds in reverse!
Has your '06 been added to the historical Survivor's List that fellow busnut Jon Ulse began compiling a few years ago? All he needs is the VIN (PD4106-XXXX), your home city/state, and whether the coach is seated, converted, or scrapped. Post that info here and it will get migrated over to the list.
Sorry about your misfortune, but with a little patience, something will turn up.
FWIW & HTH. . . ;)
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Hi RJ,
We are in the capital of California and I did sent my info to that list your mentioned.
The coach is fully converted to an RV, although I just ripped everything above the luggage compartments out and was planning to redo it, front to back.
But that is only going to happen if I can find another engine without breaking the bank.
Matt
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Matt not to confuses you but the engine does not have to be from GM only, about all transit buses used the v drive.I am looking for one for you, 1 from a 4106 would be the easiest for you but the 6v92 should be easy to find then you watch out for those from the transit buses some of the later models used right turning 6v92's.Are the freeze plugs and cracked head the only issues with the engine ?
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no. at least one of the cylinders/pistons in the lower bank ceases up. Since the pressure is pump out the coolant, the top bank doesn't get much coolant and so don't know if there is more damage on the top one..
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There is an entire cradle with engine and transmission out of an rts for sale on FB
Scott Robinson? maybe is the name?
The bus was totaled in a movie shoot, and he is parting the drivetrain in one piece. Video of it running before destruction.
6v92t ddec3 and a mechanical 730 is what it said.
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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8V-71 out of a 4905 available here in central Pa. 1979 or 80 model. Too bad its so far away.
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Seriously though, if you gutted it to redo it, better to just move on with another good running shell. There are too many out there at fire sale prices.
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There is an 8V71 block sitting in the G&R Coach lot outside in Las Vegas, I was told it was prepared to be sold, when something happened to the buyer. Years ago, call Gilbert G&R (702) 575-5939
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Maybe?
https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/hvo/d/detroit-diesels/7304077849.html
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Pm'd the link to a facebook listing, rts whole drivetrain cradle.
https://m.facebook.com/groups/MotorCoachParts/permalink/1725194380984800/
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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All the leads have not paned out so far. Thanks for the links and contacts.
Does that 6v-92 fit into the PD4106 with the cradle? Or does one have to custom-fit all that. Is the 6cylinder strong enough for a PD4106 as a highway coach?
Just wondering how people do this.
Matt
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A 6V92TA is more than strong enough and then some for an 06..>>>Dan
( Only 16 cubic inches between them,, your lawn mower is probably bigger than that..)
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Ok. But that 6v92 is an electronic engine and we would have to do a lot of modifications.
Mine is a naturally aspired, manual transmission 8v71.
The one at K&R in Michigan was a turbo-charged one.
All others I checked and they are gone.
Thanks for looking around!
Matt
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The 6v92 comes both ways electronic or non electric it works on the cradle with just a few mods the air intake and exhaust take some work, buy one with the V730 Allison it easier to install and no clutch to deal with
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And you DO WANT one turbo charged..>>>Dan
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That assembly is the big chance to go automatic all at once.
The rest of the bus won't care much about whether the injectors are activated mechanically or elctrically...
Turbo makes you altitude proof...
An opportunity or project creep...?
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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Id say that the 4 dreaded letters are getting closer and closer.... WWAI!
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Id say that the 4 dreaded letters are getting closer and closer.... WWAI!
Ok I give what is WWAI? I google it and came up with:
Acronym Definition
WWAI World Wide Article Information
WWAI Wagga Wagga Agricultural Institute (research; Australia)
WWAI Whale Watching Association of Iceland
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While We’re At It
Credit goes to Eric brown for the saying
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I turbocharged my 8V-71 with air to air intercooler in 2012. It was the best thing ever. Went from 300hp and 800lb/ft torque to 375hp and 1125lb/ft torque (7G75 injectors). REALLY wakes up the 8V-71 and makes it truly enjoyable to drive. Instead of 32mph up hills, I do 45mph. BIG difference. Good Luck, TomC
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So, WWAI, I think we are going to bring the old lady to the scrapyard. Will be crying on that day. We had some awesome family vacations with that coach.
If anyone wants any parts for cheaper or not so cheap let me know. I might have a weekend to take all kinds of stuff out.
I will make some efforts to get some things detached if they can be removed...
I will sell a complete set of windows.
That's 5 original frames with new black glass windows (they have no stoppers/locks), 3x just one giant piece of glass (we glued them in just in February but I will cut them out and clean them to reuse them) and the D windows , also glued in. I can send pictures if someone is interested.
PM me with a wish list :-)
I might post some things on the sales page here later.
Thanks for everyone's help!
Matt
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The stock 4:11 differential is worth money for 4905 owners as they are hard to come by.
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Surely the bus still has value as a parts bus to someone. Before you take it to the crusher maybe list it for sale at the scrap value to see if anyone wants it.
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Re: engine for a 4905 in central PA
I believe I have the same problem and will probably need to swap in a new engine in my 4905A. Any info on the engine in PA mentioned?
Also: what would you expect to pay for one?
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The one in MI was $1400 turbo without transmission.
Contact cheesie directly for the PA one.
Matt
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Damn Matt,
Us none mechanics know to shut up and watch the wizzards try to help you. But know that we do watch with great fascination hoping to learn something. I was sure someone would pull a rabbit, or motor, out of their hat. I will have to be nicer to my 6V92 if motors are drying up. And now a moment of silence as another asphalt annihilator sadly goes off the active bus rolls.
Best of luck finding another bus.
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Maybe I missed something, but is the bus otherwise in good shape? Or is it so bad that there is no point doing an in-frame to bring it back to life?
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Matt have you tried these guys in West Sac. They had a 4106 that they rebuilt years ago and the guy never came back. Don't know if they still have it but I know they have 2 strokes or may know who does.
https://www.valleypowersystems.com/
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If they can't do an in-frame what is the differences between a LH and RH engine? I would think:
1. Cams
2. Starter
3. Blower
Could they not be transferred between the original and replacement engine?
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Cams,oil pump;idler gear and starter if you have the right crank shaft the blowers are the same
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Sounds almost exactly like my own situation (1978 P8M4905A).
I assumed that opening all the draincocks would drain ALL the coolant. It did pop a freeze plug but now I'm seeping coolant into the oil, so either a crack or seals. I had also overheated it, driving the long road up to Taos NM ,and had to change the top head gasket. Probably did some damage then, too.
One question: I read that these buses were designed so the engine could be changed out it a few hours. Is that right?
Whoever posted that it makes more sense to start over... I hate to admit it, but you're probably right. I only Paid $2500 for it 10+ years ago.
Anyone have use for a decent shell, CHEAP? Located in NY State. Previous owner worked for Grumman, assembling aircraft and did a beautiful job on the alterations he made to the skin- can't even tell they aren't original!
And I cringe to even mention it, but what is my approximate scrap value?
Wobbleman