BCM Community
Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: Scott & Heather on September 16, 2021, 04:23:32 PM
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Almost 11 years now fulltiming in two different buses…I’m getting weary of the constant mechanical drama. Just got stranded for the 5th time in this bus pm 322 down a steep grade with a broken ujoint. Had to get towed and of course now waiting to get the part fixed and bus back on the road. It’s always something. Literally about to put the bus up for sale. Those who have known me on here since I joined in 2009 know I’ve been a longtime hard core bus owner and fulltimer with my two little girls and wife. Last year I even swapped engines on this beast myself. Not scared of doing the job, just tired. Someday I just want to take a trip across country without drama. For reference, we drive our coach 15,000 miles a year.
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Don't think a different vehicle will be any easier. They all need maintenance. The all break down from time to time and need fixing.
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Let out that primal scream, and sleep on it a few times.
So long as the repairs are done well, which you do, you don't re-visit that component again, until it dies another natural death.
Just as the coach is running out of things to wear out, you don't want to pack it in now?
But, just for fun, sit down and cost out the other ways you can do ministry, and feel better when the coach rises to the top of the "all things considered" pile.
Or, if it doesn't, then the right thing to do, is take the other "best" route ... thoughtful use of His resources being a responsibility...
We're pulling for you, no matter which path...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
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And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
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Well, not to be one to bring up the obvious, but I found that when I began "improving" the engines of my vehicles to get more power I began experiencing increased maintenance and failures. Just the type of issues in fact that you have been experiencing if I recall correctly. Experience teaches me that when engine power goes up, either the driveline needs to be beefed up accordingly or service life is reduced, sometimes dramatically. Similar issues with cooling, etc, etc. I know it's wonderful to have the extra power, and also highly addictive, but there is a very real cost involved.
Jim
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He was doing fine till he gave me all his spare parts :P ,he is a tough young man with a great young family he will be ok when he takes a deep breath
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I feel your pain I get it. It's always the first thing on my mind every trip every day of the trip did I pack all the tools and parts I think I'm going to need. I sure hope it starts when I push the button and I should have changed these lines and those hoses boy I hope they will make one more trip. If this breaks where I am I going to find these parts that are rare and hard to find. I guess if I had a ton of money I'd feel better. Not to mention how pissed Mama is going to be if we break down.
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How old were the ujoints? Greased regularlily?use the premium replacements as the cheaper models don't handle torque as well as long.
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Ditto Jim's point about adding HP that causes more stress on other components built not designed for the added HP. I know when cars are souped up, first the engine, then the driveline, differentials, tranny, brakes, etc.
As Scott states, he's been on the road for many years preceding the recent engine upgrade so he'd need to fill the timeline and incident frequency and types of failures. It is surprising that he's experiencing such failures on only 15k/year.
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I suspect that U-joint was giving signs of being worn well before it failed. Regular maintenance should have caught it.
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On the other side of the performance coin is a bus like ours. Oem stock, a true turtle if you will... Running the same U joints & drive line as we did since 79 purchase. We like it that way & if we ever caravanned we'll meet you there cause ya probably wouldn't want to follow... Lol
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Scott I feel your pain!
After up sizing our fleet by 7 buses in one year, back in 2009-2010 and being super bus year and a SUPER HOT August! We experienced a rash of break downs where dad an I literally went out with parts and tools in a truck and a bus going to a broke down bus, giving the group and driver the bus we drove up in, and working on the broke down bus in hotel parking lots having parts over-nighted to the hotel, getting it running and cleaned up just in time to get another call and taking the bus we just fixed to another driver and doing it all over again 5 times in a row literally bus to bus to bus!
OH we were worn out exhausted and TIRED of BREAK DOWNS, but it was the nature of the beast and part of being in business!
We made it home finally and things slowed back to normal maintenance, but it was tempting to throw in the towel!
Trust me when dad told me in 2014 it just wasn't fun anymore I couldn't have been happier!
We closed the doors and ain't looked back since!
But I still love buses and am still going to convert the one I kept to us as I retire!
I think you'll get it ironed out pretty soon.
The other option might be a used professional conversion with low miles! (after all you know these old revenue buses are wore out before they get in the hands of converters, but even new buses well maintained still break from time to time!)
;D BK ;D
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Some friends of mine own a gasoline powered motorhome around 35 feet that they use quite regularly. They were driving 20k to 25K a year before they moved and now do about 10k to 15k per year. They have had several major issues with the motorhome over the decade or so they have had it. They blew the engine one trip and had a new one installed. I am pretty sure it was out of warranty so on their dime. They had wheel bearing issues resulting in major work including new front spindles. It took a week plus to get the spindles and that was pre-COVID. They are constantly fixing things.
A motorhome is probably not going to be much better than a bus.
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But cheaper to fix. A new motor in a gasser is $5000 to $7000. Last time I checked
a few years ago , $25,000 to $30,000 for a rebuild at Stewrart Stevenson on a 8V92. House goodies breaking down would be the same. Wonder if Cliff would chime in and let us know about His fairly new ride in the current one on cost compared to a bus.
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Trucks and RV with the 650 hp Cummins and Cat engines with 2000 ft lbs of torque have the same u joint has Scotts bus,the new engine torque of 1500 ft lbs at the most had nothing to do with it
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And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
I just wanted to repeat this most excellent quote.
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I just wanted to repeat this most excellent quote.
DITTO
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But cheaper to fix. A new motor in a gasser is $5000 to $7000. Last time I checked
a few years ago , $25,000 to $30,000 for a rebuild at Stewrart Stevenson on a 8V92. House goodies breaking down would be the same. Wonder if Cliff would chime in and let us know about His fairly new ride in the current one on cost compared to a bus.
The point was less about the cost, but more about the fact that a reasonably new motorhome can break down just like a bus. The engine in the RV was a lot of work to get in and out of the RV because it is puller like most class A gasoline motorhomes. They were down for at least two weeks.
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Sure a 4104 doesn't give much in the way of issues. They were WAY overbuilt. Those u-joints are same as newer coaches with twice the torque. U-joints will stand a lot and last many thousands of miles with regular greasing.
How many newer owners have ever greased theirs? I'm not talking about the old heads. Use the lubrication chart and do the fittings in a pm. If you have a missing or broken off fitting, replace it. If you have one or more that are difficult to access, take the time to change it over to an angled one. Grease fittings are cheap.
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Galatians 6:9
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Two thoughts:
We full timed for a year when I retired from Uncle Sam. We had a 2 year old Allegro. The Cat and Allison never failed us. It always worked. A long list of everything else went to ca ca. Levelers wouldn't go down or come up. Or one wouldn't. Slide wouldn't go out. Twice wouldn't go in. Too much else to list. We were SICK of it.
We parked at our little horse farm in Ocala after a year a built a house. When we could get out of the bus, and did not need to run it all the time, we missed travel and liked it again. Some will never leave life on the road but being able to get out of the vehicle healed us from almost never going again. We had a couple other smaller ones since, but missed air bags and a bit more room.
We've had out 1980 Prevost for a year. Major engine shut down first trip due to engine run relay. Happened at 68 mph. Not fun! Other little things since that "lets sell it" event, but we love the ride, love how quiet and solid it is at 65mph. And even my little buttercup can't fill all the cabinets. Been all over America in the Allegro so shorter trips in this bus are good enough.
However, hate trying to find people to work on it that are not 2 or more hours away and as you have discovered I'm sure, the parts nightmare.
But we love it. I'm 64 and we will keep it until I am too old to want to do the septic hook ups. Sorry you feel drama. Maybe you need a little place in one place you can step away from it now and then? Just an idea.....
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Ted,
Do not take this the wrong way. I believe you need to research "Scott & Heathers" background as to their full-timing and Scott's music ministry etc., etc. Scott is not a novice and supports his family with his ministry. He has many, many, many posts. Just saying.
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Sometimes you just gotta vent. Bus ujoint failure was the result of a strap bolt coming loose. Had no idea until it bit the dirt. The repower on the coach has nothing to do with it. Coach runs cool as I’ve completely removed the transmission heat exchanger and replaced it with a huge 36”x27” Hayden trans cooler with twin cooling fans. And as for the 520hp setting, it isn’t too much for the driveline at all. The issue is simply that we put the miles on the bus and stuff just wears out or breaks. It was a charter coach back in the day so we don’t know the status of everything. I have fresh brakes, an engine that was just completely rebuilt from the bare block by Leid Diesel and has 3500 miles on it right now. Runs amazing. Pushing up grades in PA at 70mph is invigorating to say the least. I just am finding that waiting 5 hours for a tow…a week for parts to arrive, trying to find people who even want to mess with a bus. It’s just a huge pain. 4 different tow companies wanted nothing to do with towing a coach bus. I was almost out of luck until I found a small family run outfit that owns a single heavy tow truck. Thankful for them. Yes I swapped the engine out myself with some advice from cliff and Jack Conrad and others on here. I’m not new to these beasts…and we love our bus…two bathrooms, washer and dryer, full kitchen, very very comfortable in the heat or cold. Just wishing for more predictable trips.
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No offense taken Gary. I have not seen them on this site in the year I have been on it. Did not know their background. Just floating an idea that worked for us when we were at wits end with breakdowns. Obviously not an option for them. I wish them well with their ministry and wish I knew half of what he does as far as fixing it on the road.
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Would Coachnet be a worthwhile thing to have or do they not tow buses? I read alot of good things about them on FB on the skoolie forums. I do not have any towing plans as of yet until I get mine done and ready to roll.
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Coachnet is probably the best still out there,, and they do write bus conversions also,,<<<Dan
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I have goodsam. Have had to use it a few times over the years without any problems. Others have not had the same experience.
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People I know that have gave up on buses and bought the truck conversions seem to like those better for less machinal issues and shops are easier to find for service.I don't like the looks of one my self but they drive and ride great plus they are modern drive trains that helps with service
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Now you know one of the many reasons I'm building my 1985 Kenworth 90" Aerodyne cabover with 32ft box behind with 13ft garage (separate). It is SO much easier working on it. Granted it is noisier (but in a good way), and doesn't ride as smooth as my AMGeneral, but I just love driving it-especially with the Allison automatic. And with the Caterpillar 3406B mechanical, I'll always have someone that knows how to work on it (Caterpillar still makes the 3406C mechanical-basically the same engine). I highly recommend you get away from the bus and look at truck conversions. Good Luck, TomC
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What is the driving license requirements for the semi-truck conversions? How are they registered and insured?
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The are the same as RV's easy to insure too they are called and sold as super C's or B's in Rv talk
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The are the same as RV's easy to insure too they are called and sold as super C's or B's in Rv talk
After selling my 1991 XL Prevost a couple months back, thinking about the Super C's myself. I feel your pain Scott. Seems like the 11 + years we owned ours, take a small trip and work on something, ( not engine related) but imagine that will be on anything we run down the road with.
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After selling my 1991 XL Prevost a couple months back, thinking about the Super C's myself. I feel your pain Scott. Seems like the 11 + years we owned ours, take a small trip and work on something, ( not engine related) but imagine that will be on anything we run down the road with.
We travel with Jim and Becky they sold their Eagle and bought a super C on a Freightliner 40 ft long with a DD13 500 hp engine and they average a constant 10.2 MPG and they love it
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Yeah we’ve seriously talked many times about a truck conversion. Easier to tow, easier to get engine access for fixes, excellent parts a availability nationwide, better MPGs, less overheating issues with front mount radiator, better drivability, better safety with a nose to crunch before my legs do. Lots of pluses and few minuses. I do think it’s in our future, because we are traveling more than we ever were and I don’t see that going away any time soon. I’m 39 and Heather is 37. Our girls are 5 and 3 so even though we’ve been fulltiming for almost 11 years now, we have a lifetime of coach travel ahead of us so we should consider something slightly more modern than a two stroke 1992 bus.
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Scott you can take a look at https://www.racingjunk.com just to see things that have been done. A lot of those would not interest you since they have garages attached but some are amazing.
TOM
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Seen a few this summer, and one had a semi tractor pulling an rv trailer.
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What I don't like about the super C's is they are hard for older people to get in and out of because of the entrance they set so high
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Yeah but by the time Scott is that old the girls will be moved out and there may be more and better options. Sounds like for them the Super C might be a real good choice. OTOH, how big of a sleeper can you put on one? Big enough for 4 people who are used to a bus to ramble around in on trips?
Jim
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What I don't like about the super C's is they are hard for older people to get in and out of because of the entrance they set so high
Guess it all depends on how things are situated. I've seen some nice commercially made Super C units with a side door just like any Class A motorhome, complete with a step well and drop down outside steps. Pretty easy to just use the side door and walk into the cab if things are set up correctly.
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Guess it all depends on how things are situated. I've seen some nice commercially made Super C units with a side door just like any Class A motorhome, complete with a step well and drop down outside steps. Pretty easy to just use the side door and walk into the cab if things are set up correctly.
Super C's have a side door but where you have 4 steps most of those have 7 steps or more,they set on the truck frame no way around the steps
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As I stated in the Super C thread, the floor height on a modern bus (H3, J or E) is higher than the frame rails on any truck.
MCI later Es and Js are a very inexpensive platform to put miles on.
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As I stated in the Super C thread, the floor height on a modern bus (H3, J or E) is higher than the frame rails on any truck.
Super C's bodies are raised on the frames for the slides almost a foot I just came back from looking at some super C's made by Reengage and Winnebago those things are pricey new @ 400 grand some are nice though