Author Topic: bus crash 5 miles from my home.  (Read 5678 times)

Offline RoyJ

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 192
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2011, 05:16:23 PM »
Brian, I don't think good drivers work for a 100 bucks a day my friend owns Swift Transportation In Phoenix I heard drivers start at around .31 cents after 5 years get over .40 per mile that is over 200 bucks a day and they get all kinds of bonuses to go along with that they do ok 


good luck

Bus and coach drivers up here get between $14 to $17 per hour, so factoring 13 hr max per day, you can get up to $220. On a 2 - 3 day tour, you're also looking at $80 - 90 in tips. I've even heard of drivers selling bottled water for $1, and making $30 or so per trip.

Still lower than most long haul truckers, but the work is much more pleasureable. I'd take lower pay + 4 star hotel over truck sleeper and no shower any day!


Back to origional topic. These events are tragic, but there's not much regulations can do. I wonder if tires were an issue. Up here, many coaches run all position tires year round, or mild traction tread. Very few drivers can chain up, as there isn't space on modern coaches.

Online buswarrior

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4790
  • '75 MC8 8V71 HT740
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2011, 07:28:16 PM »
Sliding a coach off the road and flopping it over in the ditch all by yourself in the snow is driver error.

Ran most of my career on all position tires, as have most of the middle aged and older coach drivers.

All position tires would still be a viable choice for a 40 foot coach for commercial operations, though they are dwindling in number now.

Traction tires showed up relatively recently on coaches and are good for keeping the 45 foot coaches from getting stuck in the parking lot. The 45 footers are a real pain for getting stuck, weight distribution and tire loading is the devil for them.

However, traction tires like to sing and howl out on the highway...passengers don't always like that.
 
Once moving on a snow covered highway, directional stability of any tire type is quite acceptable.

In a snowstorm, if given the choice of any vehicle, my first choice has always been a coach. Nothing is more well rounded and stable in performance, especially as it gets deeper and rutted.

For a busnut, if you go off onto the lawn regularly, I'd go for some modest traction tires on the drives.

We've all seen the rally pics where it rains and someone spins their tires on the grass... it's all over after that.

happy coaching!
buswarrior
Frozen North, Greater Toronto Area

Offline RoyJ

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 192
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2011, 09:40:46 PM »
Traction tires showed up relatively recently on coaches and are good for keeping the 45 foot coaches from getting stuck in the parking lot. The 45 footers are a real pain for getting stuck, weight distribution and tire loading is the devil for them.

Don't most 45' models have liftable tags? Or atleast a drain valve? I bet a loaded 45 footer without the tag would put a CRAPLOAD of pressure on the drive axle!

My lil 35 foot coach definitely has no traction problems. Having a T-drive (more rear overhang), my weight distribution is almost 30/70 when loaded.

Offline RJ

  • Vantarè Conversion "Vivian"
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3598
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2011, 02:26:14 AM »
All -

After having been a professional charter bus driver myself, putting over 80,000 miles per year on various makes and models of coaches way back when, I totally agree with Buswarrior:

Sliding a coach off the road and flopping it over in the ditch all by yourself in the snow is driver error.

The generic catch-all term the CHP (and other HPs) usually use is "driving too fast for conditions," even if that means plodding along at 25 mph in 2nd gear on an icy highway in a white-out blizzard.

HOWEVER:

What's the possibility that maybe, just maybe, the coach hit some black ice, changing it's direction towards the center median.  Driver now helpless until the front axle regains it's grip, panic setting in and now (incorrectly) hard on the brakes.  LF wheel hits the soft grassy median, already soggy from too much winter weather and over she goes.

The accident investigation is not complete yet, and, as usual, the MSM only reports bad news first in attention-grabbing headline form, the heck with reporting the truth even if it's staring them in the face.  Bad news sells, Pollyanna doesn't.

I'm not taking the driver's side here, just pointing out that far too often folk, especially non-industry "armchair professionals" and attention-whore politicians, are way too quick to pass judgment before all the facts come to light.

Those carriers operating "under the radar" have been a problem, especially on the East Coast, for a number of years.

I'll address charter driver pay in a new thread.

FWIW & HTH. . .

 ;)
RJ Long
PD4106-2784: Donated to the Pacific Bus Museum
S14947: 1980 MC-5C Shell 6V92/HT-740
S13406: 1978 MC-5C Angola Coach - Swapped for vvv
M1001907: 1992 Prevost XL Vantarè Conversion 8V92T/HT-755 (DDEC/ATEC)
Cheney WA

Offline desi arnaz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 560
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2011, 04:04:01 AM »
i was not there, but there was not much of a storm going on that night.
btw strange you mention Pollyanna as littleton nh is the Pollyanna town where the author was born.
thomas f  Bethlehem n.h

Online belfert

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6039
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2011, 02:27:49 PM »
I think most charter operators pay more than a lot of the linehaul guys.  I am a bit surprised a charter company would allow drivers to sell bottled water though.

I know a Megabus customer who had to help the driver stay awake once because he was falling asleep.  Personally, I would have called 911 and reported him.  I don't know if low pay had anything to do with it.  Maybe the guy had a day job too since was driving the night run?
Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN

Online buswarrior

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4790
  • '75 MC8 8V71 HT740
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2011, 05:41:45 PM »
A loaded 45' er puts a crapload of pressure on the steer tires.

You gotta push them through.

Dumping the tag axle pressure is only a marginal variable. And makes things worse if the drives are someplace they can sink or dig themselves in.

And you can create a condition where when you dump the tag, it lightens the steers via the seesaw, then it won't steer without some weight back on the front...

You still need enough traction between the drive tires and the ground to shove the fronts and drag the tags through the accumulation.

All the weight ratios between steer/drive/tag and the weights on the tire contact patches are significantly enough different on the 45 foot coaches that they can be quite a different animal than a 40 footer under limited traction conditions.

45 footers have some of the traction troubles that used to be reserved for the heavy trucks, and we in the coach business never had to think about.

Busnuts will have greater challenges with 45 foot coaches getting off the lawn, if they stray onto unimproved surfaces...

happy coaching!
buswarrior

Frozen North, Greater Toronto Area

Offline happycamperbrat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2011, 10:58:16 PM »
F Troop? Now that's funny!!!!  ;D ;D ;D


Not that Im old enough to know who/what F Troop is though.......... umm, hmm   ::)
The Little GTO is a 102" wide and 40' long 1983 GMC RTS II and my name is Teresa in case I forgot to sign my post

Offline RoyJ

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 192
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2011, 11:44:07 PM »
I think most charter operators pay more than a lot of the linehaul guys.  I am a bit surprised a charter company would allow drivers to sell bottled water though.

All depends on the size of the company. And by "charter", I don't mean Greyhound or Megabus, those are more formal linehaul companies. I mean the companies that does scenic tours, school trips, sports team trips, etc.

With some smaller companies, drivers take their buses everywhere between runs - Walmart, visit nearby friend, McDonalds. And as long as they're safe, reliable, courteous drivers, why not? (within reason)

artvonne

  • Guest
Re: bus crash 5 miles from my home.
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2011, 09:56:11 AM »
  While its sad to see a Bus wreck, we should all try to keep things in perspective. First, as noted, our wonderful Media loves to twist everything for greater impact. But if you take just 5 minutes and read through the NTSB website, you find the number of Bus crashes to be remarkably low. They are without a doubt, the safest vehicles on the road. Now when I say Bus, I mean OTR intercity Bus, not School Bus, and the NTSB seperates them.

  In reality, news today has all become more national. Things you never would have heard about 10 years ago will be all over the news coast to coast within minutes or hours. Except of course real political news you should know about. They dont want to tell you whats happening two states away....

  And a Bus crash? They approach it like an airplane accident. Even a little Cessna going down will make it onto Fox and CNN now, so a Bus has no chance of remaining benign. Keep it between the lines folks, were being watched like never before.  Saw a billboard headed out of Little Rock yesterday : Hit by a Big Rig? Call 1-800 XXX-XXXX. Makes ya wonder. Its a jungle out there.