Help -- ruptured power steering pipe in Mobile, AL

[robertglines1]

Sean; it is easy for us to arm chair quarter back.  I just had a idea.  It seams you need a mechanical saddle clamp. Like Clifford said.  Your description of hole reminded me of saddles we use to penetrate tubing to tap a line into.  why not use one but not add line--cap if necessary..  picture a 2 piece clamp with 4 screws. 2---- 0n each side of pipe with a rubber seal compressed by them against pipe. I have even seen this now for pvc pipe repair. or like adding a line for ice maker from water line in home..  actually one of them might work.  Truly do wish you a speedy outcome. 

[Sean]

Update:

Things are not always as they appear.  My gut feeling that I had a high-pressure side problem was, in fact, correct.

Before tackling anything at all I decided to put a couple gallons of fluid in and, if need be, crank the steering a bit just to make sure I had correctly identified the leak.  Before I even started the engine, fluid started running out of a hole in the high-pressure supply line that was in a spot I could not see.  The good news here is that this is a standard braided steel hose and I will be on my way shortly to the hose shop to get it replaced.  The bad news was that it was a bear to get out without a pit.

The other bad news is that the issue I originally identified will still need to be addressed.  It's possible that the groove I spotted has not actually worn all the way through the pipe, but I won't know for sure until I fix the high side and pressurize the system.  But one way or another, it will need to be repaired, as it is sure to break open later if it has not already.

I also spotted another couple of rub spots while I was in there, including one on the main supply line from the air compressor.  So I will be taking care of those as well while I have the hatch open.

Thanks to everyone for the help, and I will post another update when I get the supply hose back in place.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

[thomasinnv]

Sean, it appears you have some light at the end of the tunnel. If/when you repair the high pressure leak and find the low side not to be leaking yet, you could possibly fill in the gash with epoxy or jb weld after a vigorous cleaning effort, and wrap a rubber hose around the area for a insulator/protector.

[artvonne]

run a self tapping screw into the hole and encase it in some jb weld

Thats what I am thinking, or quick dry epoxy if you can get it clean enough.

  I dont feel either of those are good ideas. Your risking getting a chunk of something into the system that could damage the pump or steering gear or both. Right now the system is still clean, the object should be to keep it that way as much as possible. While cutting the line might create filings, once open they could be wiped out and cause little risk. Patching the line over with a dressing wont contaminate it either.

  Uhhhh, think about bypassing a blood vessel. Why not just run another hydraulic hose temporarily bypassing everything. Get 30 or 40 feet of hose, find the right ends, figure out how to route it through, and your gone, outta there, back on the road. You can then drive wherever, and however far you want or desire to find the right shop to make a proper fix.

[robertglines1]

Old School: Leather makes a better friction protector than rubber. My opinion only.   Bob

[Oonrahnjay]

Sean - Here's hoping that things are going / went well.  Best wishes.

[Sean]

Well, the entire problem turned out to be the high pressure supply hose.  That would explain the bang, the immediate loss of steering assist, and the emptying of several gallons of steering fluid in a matter of seconds.

The fairly serious groove in the return pipe has, apparently, not yet worn all the way through.  I was misled by the fact that that's where most of the fluid had accumulated after the rupture and that damage was so easy to find.

The Parker guy talked me out of replacing the braided stainless hose with the same stuff, instead selling me their standard high-pressure (4000 psi), high-temperature, DOT-approved hose which appears to have a covering of woven synthetic fiber.  It was about a 4' hose and the replacement cost me $63, which is really all I needed to spend on this project.

While I was at Parker, though, I also bought a couple 37° caps and plugs, so the next time I have to take a hose off I don't get so much fluid everywhere.  And, surprisingly, they had a 22mm bite-ring pipe union in stock, for $25, and I picked that up as well, so that if and when the return pipe finally gives out, I will have that as an option.

Getting that stupid hose back in place was a back-breaking chore, but once I got everything tightened the steering works fine.  I did my best to secure the hose out of harm's way, and put some slit hoses over the other rub points as protection.  There was really no way to secure the return pipe properly, so the best I could do was to put a length of silicone hose over the damaged area.  At least with the union on board now I know I can fix it later if it ever starts leaking.

A great big thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread -- you guys are the greatest.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

[Oonrahnjay]

  Well, the entire problem turned out to be the high pressure supply hose. 

    Thanks for the update, Sean.  Glad that it was less than $100 (and I'm sorry to hear about the PITA factor while you were dealing with it) - it sounds as if you will not have any more problems with it, considering the spec of the material that they supplied for you.  If indeed the return line with the abraded area on it is a no-pressure line, then you stand a good chance of not having any more trouble from it.

Best wishes,  BH

[white-eagle]

YAAAAAAA!!

Always nice to find out a $1000 fix is around a $100.  Did Louise take pictures?  I know Fran enjoys taking a pic or two with my face full of grease looking out from behind the pumpkin or engine  .  at least it proves we are more than bus drivers and actually know how to use the occasional wrench.

Glad you're moving again.  Happy Thanksgiving!

And to all the other Vets like me, Happy Veteran's Day!

[Busted Knuckle]

Sean,
Glad to hear that the repair was in fact simpler than it looked to be.
Now back to my original thought that the forklift guy should have been able to fix it no problem. I second that motion and stand my ground! (And if I'd guaranteed it & had to make a service call to Mobile to make good on it. I would have. But once it was discovered that they in fact could have fixed it if they had actually tested and found the actual problem, it would have been one expensive service call! fuel, labor, fresh seafood, wine & etc!)

Now back to the gouged pipe. If you want to avoid it blowing out where it is gouged. Take and clean it and I mean clean it spotless. Then take and scar it (rough it up with a file etc) all around it and around the complete pipe. Get some Marine Tex epoxy & putty   http://www.marinetex.com/  (yer already near marina's aren't you?)
Take the liquid epoxy and mix up a fair amount. Take and apply it all over the gouge and completely around the pipe making a sleeve. Once that cures take the putty and go over it but go 1-2" past the area damaged in both ways and all the way around the pipe again. You will never have to worry about that spot ever again.
 BK  

[TomC]

Sean-glad to here your up and running again and didn't have to drive the bus off the cliff.  Would be curious to know, though, how many days of down time have you experienced for mechanical problems in the entire time you've been full timing?  Good Luck, TomC

[Sean]

Tom,

That's a good question.  Let me start by saying that "down time" is a relative concept.  Usually when we end up in the shop, our attitude is "take your time, we have no place to be" -- so long as the shop is willing to let us live aboard.  So, for example, even though we just spent over two weeks at Choo Choo Garage, our "regular life" went on, just in Chattanooga rather than someplace else.  When your whole house is with you all the time, it really doesn't matter much.

That said, we have had our share of "down time" in the sense of the coach being sidelined someplace until repairs were complete.  Probably the three biggest ones were the two times we had the engine in-framed, at PEDCO, and the time we had the engine pulled out to have the end-plate gasket replaced, at Choo Choo.  In all three of those cases, the bus was undrivable (as opposed to, say, the wheel bearing work, where we could have opted to clean, pack, and replace the marginal bearing to get someplace critical), each time for a period of about two weeks, for a total of six weeks in seven years.

On top of those, we've had wheel bearings worked on twice, and each time there was a delay while we waited on parts from Europe.  Those amounted to an additional four weeks.  And we've spent perhaps another three or four weeks at Infinity Coach over the seven years to have conversion items repaired, refreshed, or updated.  Mostly the rest of our shop time has ranged from a few hours, for example to get new tires, to perhaps two days, such as to replace the blown steering pump.  On average a shop visit is probably a day, usually spending the night before or after the visit at or near the shop.  We probably see one or two of these each year, so figure another two weeks, in aggregate.

So let's see, that adds up to a grand total of maybe 15 weeks in seven and a half years, or about two weeks per year of "down time" for our full-time lifestyle.  Not counting any of the "projects" that I take care of myself on an ongoing basis -- when you use a coach full time, maintenance is unending.

To put that in perspective, we average 20,000 miles per year.  We also average 200-300 hours of generator run time per year, and about the same amount of Webasto run time.  Our water pumps, inverter, and fridge have been operating continuously 24/7 for seven years.  We've cycled the batteries (on our third set now) over 2,000 times and pumped over 24,000 gallons of water through our fresh system, and another 3,000 gallons or so through our drinking system.  We've probably burned around 23,000 gallons of diesel across all devices, and diesel fuel remains our #1 expense.  Even so, it is less than we paid in taxes alone when we lived in a condo in California.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

[eagle19952]

I would add one thought (if you get this), i would not add epoxy type materials if it were ever my intent to try and roll ( to access the divot) or cut/splice/repair with silver braze, my pipe.

Produces a perfectly controlled, stable flame hot enough to melt commercially weldable metals, glass and ceramics with thread-thin flames up to 6000° F.
http://www.littletorch.com/

[Hobie]

... it is less than we paid in taxes alone when we lived in a condo in California.

Sums it up quite nicely, like a cherry on a sundae.  Glad you are running again!



ps.  I only wish I could keep as good of records as you all do

[TomC]

Sean-GREAT way to put it, and the figures (which I'm glad you decided to share) are eye opening-especially to those who might be thinking of doing some full timing (like Donna and I) speak for them selves.  Thank you for sharing.  Good Luck, TomC