Author Topic: Starter Button Stopped Working  (Read 4569 times)

Offline Lostranger

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Starter Button Stopped Working
« on: January 06, 2013, 11:15:29 AM »
A few days ago, the starter button on my recently acquired 1999 Gillig H2000LF quit working. Will not start from either the driver's seat or the rear controls. It starts fine when I jump the starter relay. Still drives fine. I've noticed no other symptoms. I have the manuals and wiring diagrams, but if someone could point me in the right direction, I would appreciate the time savings. This bus is, of course, fully computerized.

TIA

Jim in North Carolina
Jim H.
Marion, NC
1999 Gillig H2000LF
Yes Virginia,
You CAN convert a low floor.

Offline gus

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2013, 01:15:20 PM »
If it starts when jumping the relay that is probably the problem, that relay seems to be a constant problem in many buses. Sometimes it is only corroded connections at either the start switches or the relay.

Since both switches don't work that pretty much narrows it down to the relay.

Since your bus is so new the relay is probably a generic cube relay, shouldn't be hard to replace.
PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR

Offline Rick 74 MC-8

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2013, 03:08:42 PM »
Not sure if yours is the same as an MCI. But the fuel pressure switch will cause a problem like that


 Rick 74 MC-8
About 20 Miles West Of Chicago

Offline Lin

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2013, 04:09:27 PM »
I would start with what Gus said.  You can check to see if the relay is getting current when you push the start button.  If it is, you know it is the relay.  If it is not, move up the line to find why not.
You don't have to believe everything you think.

Offline bevans6

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2013, 03:20:44 AM »
Not sure if you are calling the solenoid on the starter itself the "relay" or not, but there is usually a smaller relay in between the switch and the solenoid. 

Brian
1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Allison MT-647
Tatamagouche, Nova Scotia

Offline robertglines1

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2013, 11:21:01 AM »
neutral switch?
Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana

Offline gus

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2013, 06:28:04 PM »
If it were the starter solenoid it wouldn't start when he jumps the relay.
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Offline Lostranger

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2013, 11:50:12 AM »
I still haven't had time to sort this problem. To clarify, the starter button is not sending power to the starter relay. This relay is not a solenoid mounted on the starter. It is part of a major electrical/electronics panel mounted in the coach, behind the right rear wheel well. It is what I have always referred to as a "Ford-type" relay since I'm not aware of any GM vehicles using something similar in the starter circuit. Shaped like a small can. 24v leads bolt to each side. Two smaller studs one one side facing me. One of the smaller studs is supposed to receive 24v when I press the starter button. It does not. When I jump that stud to the much larger positive lead that is always hot when the main battery switch is on, the bus starts without problem. Something upstream of this solenoid is causing the problem. I hope that by next week I can get back to working on the bus. The starter button issue will be a top priority.

Jim in North Carolina
Jim H.
Marion, NC
1999 Gillig H2000LF
Yes Virginia,
You CAN convert a low floor.

Offline gus

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2013, 12:21:05 PM »
Jim,

It may be the switch, I had to replace the start toggle on my 4104. Make sure you use a momentary on if yours is a toggle.

It could be in the wiring or simply a bad connection at of the terminal boards. However, these are more common in older buses, not newer ones like yours.
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Offline robertglines1

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2013, 12:30:41 PM »
When I just mentioned neutral I was refering to transmission.
Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana

Offline chessie4905

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2013, 06:53:45 PM »
try jumping directly across starter button contacts. They can get corroded, dirty, or deteriorated contact points from age.
GMC h8h 649#028 (4905)
Pennsylvania-central

Offline Lin

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2013, 08:25:51 PM »
It is good that you now have determined that the relay is not getting power from the start button.  The next question is whether the start button is getting power from wherever it is connected to and whether it is passing it on.  If there is power in but no power out, the problem is at the button-- clean the contacts or replace the button as needed.  If the button is not getting power, follow that system back until you find the flaw.  If power is going through the button but not reaching the relay, there is a break somewhere in between.

I don't know what your transmission set up is.  The neutral safety switch can be at the transmission or in the gear shift.
You don't have to believe everything you think.

Offline gus

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2013, 08:58:29 PM »
Lin has a good point I overlooked, try jumping the trans safety switch - make double sure it is in neutral or do it with a long jump away from under the bus.
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Offline Lin

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2013, 08:12:38 AM »
Bob has the patent on the neutral switch idea.
You don't have to believe everything you think.

Offline gus

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Re: Starter Button Stopped Working
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2013, 01:50:27 PM »
Lin,

You're way too modest, I completely forgot about the neutral switch because mine doesn't work half the time!

My gears can't be changed without air either, bummer! At least I can go back and move the selector with a screwdriver.
PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR