Natural Resources Canada is a department of the Canadian Federal Goverment.The quote referred to "when an engine idles for an extended period of time" apparently is valid on both gasoline and diesel engines in regard to the components that it refers to. Richard: Here is a link to one of their pages where they have a link to "ask the experts" so you may want to ask them questions about the study.http://www.nrcan-rncan.gc.ca/inter/products_e.html
Quote from: HighTechRedneck on January 15, 2007, 10:09:42 AMQuote from: DrivingMissLazy on January 15, 2007, 09:23:03 AMI would really like for some of these people crying wolf to come up with some certified data, or forget about it. RichardI personally have idled all night to stay warm once and noticed no problem. And like I said, all former comercial coaches and transits have idled extensively already. But I don't doubt for a minute that it can shorten engine life. But here is some information from the manual and an article from Fleetmag.com citing a study:Quote from: Page 68, RTS Coach Operating Manual (C-8724-A)ENGINE IDLINGAvoid unnecessary or prolonged idling. The engine cools faster when allowed to idle in extreme outside temperatures. This can cause deposits to form in the comustion chamber, on exhaust valves, and around piston rings.If you plan to park for more than a minute or two or to leave the coach shut off the engine. If idling is absolutely necessary due to the nature or conditions of the run, try to maintain 1000 engine rpm (Fast Idle).Article from Fleetmag.com - "Shutting Down", by Mark Gehred-O'Connellhttp://fleetmag.com/articles/2004/fm0304/fm0304_02.htmQuoteAccording to Natural Resources Canada (NRCan), when an engine idles for extended periods, engine oil becomes contaminated more quickly, because of the large amounts of intake air. At 600 rpm, excess air in the combustion cycle cools the cylinder liners, resulting in incomplete combustion and condensation of unburned fuel on cylinder walls. These deposits are drawn into the oil sump where they contaminate the engine oil and reduce its lubricity. NRCan studies show that prolonged idling can reduce the operating life of diesel engine oil by 75 percent, from 600 engine-hours to 150 . NRCan also finds that idling produces carbon deposits and unburned fuel residues that accumulate and can damage spark plugs, fuel injectors, valve seats and piston crowns.Studies performed by Caterpillar, Inc. indicate that low engine operating temperatures at idle will allow water vapor to form and condense in the crankcase. The water in the crankcase will combine chemically with sulfur oxides and result in sulfuric acid. The acid can damage bearings, cylinders, piston rings and valve stems. According to the company, this damage could result in a 15 percent reduction in engine life.You know, I am truly inclined to trust the studies performed by anyone that is concerned about spark plug life in a diesel engine. And by my calculations 600 engine hours is equal to about 36,000 miles at 60 mph. Reduced by 75% that would be about 9,000 miles. Who is this outfit anyhow?Richard
Quote from: DrivingMissLazy on January 15, 2007, 09:23:03 AMI would really like for some of these people crying wolf to come up with some certified data, or forget about it. RichardI personally have idled all night to stay warm once and noticed no problem. And like I said, all former comercial coaches and transits have idled extensively already. But I don't doubt for a minute that it can shorten engine life. But here is some information from the manual and an article from Fleetmag.com citing a study:Quote from: Page 68, RTS Coach Operating Manual (C-8724-A)ENGINE IDLINGAvoid unnecessary or prolonged idling. The engine cools faster when allowed to idle in extreme outside temperatures. This can cause deposits to form in the comustion chamber, on exhaust valves, and around piston rings.If you plan to park for more than a minute or two or to leave the coach shut off the engine. If idling is absolutely necessary due to the nature or conditions of the run, try to maintain 1000 engine rpm (Fast Idle).Article from Fleetmag.com - "Shutting Down", by Mark Gehred-O'Connellhttp://fleetmag.com/articles/2004/fm0304/fm0304_02.htmQuoteAccording to Natural Resources Canada (NRCan), when an engine idles for extended periods, engine oil becomes contaminated more quickly, because of the large amounts of intake air. At 600 rpm, excess air in the combustion cycle cools the cylinder liners, resulting in incomplete combustion and condensation of unburned fuel on cylinder walls. These deposits are drawn into the oil sump where they contaminate the engine oil and reduce its lubricity. NRCan studies show that prolonged idling can reduce the operating life of diesel engine oil by 75 percent, from 600 engine-hours to 150 . NRCan also finds that idling produces carbon deposits and unburned fuel residues that accumulate and can damage spark plugs, fuel injectors, valve seats and piston crowns.Studies performed by Caterpillar, Inc. indicate that low engine operating temperatures at idle will allow water vapor to form and condense in the crankcase. The water in the crankcase will combine chemically with sulfur oxides and result in sulfuric acid. The acid can damage bearings, cylinders, piston rings and valve stems. According to the company, this damage could result in a 15 percent reduction in engine life.
I would really like for some of these people crying wolf to come up with some certified data, or forget about it. Richard
ENGINE IDLINGAvoid unnecessary or prolonged idling. The engine cools faster when allowed to idle in extreme outside temperatures. This can cause deposits to form in the comustion chamber, on exhaust valves, and around piston rings.If you plan to park for more than a minute or two or to leave the coach shut off the engine. If idling is absolutely necessary due to the nature or conditions of the run, try to maintain 1000 engine rpm (Fast Idle).
According to Natural Resources Canada (NRCan), when an engine idles for extended periods, engine oil becomes contaminated more quickly, because of the large amounts of intake air. At 600 rpm, excess air in the combustion cycle cools the cylinder liners, resulting in incomplete combustion and condensation of unburned fuel on cylinder walls. These deposits are drawn into the oil sump where they contaminate the engine oil and reduce its lubricity. NRCan studies show that prolonged idling can reduce the operating life of diesel engine oil by 75 percent, from 600 engine-hours to 150 . NRCan also finds that idling produces carbon deposits and unburned fuel residues that accumulate and can damage spark plugs, fuel injectors, valve seats and piston crowns.Studies performed by Caterpillar, Inc. indicate that low engine operating temperatures at idle will allow water vapor to form and condense in the crankcase. The water in the crankcase will combine chemically with sulfur oxides and result in sulfuric acid. The acid can damage bearings, cylinders, piston rings and valve stems. According to the company, this damage could result in a 15 percent reduction in engine life.
Who is this outfit anyhow?Richard
Regarding the 600 hours, that was the engine oil life figure, not engine life. Very good point I missed that little word oil. Now I am wondering if 600 hours for an oil change is a good number? Does anybody change oil based on an elapsed time running meter as opposed to a odometer? Richard
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