Help. Want to do a bus conversion but maybe a DP MH is smarter.

[MaybeABus]

Hello everyone,

Probably opening a can of worms here but I am seeking opinions regarding DP MH vs. a conversion bus. We are just starting our search and as we look at assets we have insofar as taking on a conversion project it seems we have enough to consider it. And I can bring my small company and it's skilled people to the front on the project as the coach will almost certainly end up owned by the corporation. Besides I love building things.

Our search thus far has been limited to manufacturers of DP's in northern Indiana, as we live in South Bend. We have narrowed our search to Entegra, Newmar and our favorite American Coach. Our needs include high combined weight rating as compared to GVW. Without boring you all with the details we have need for 15K towing capacity, more would be good. We simply do not care for Super C coaches so we are pretty much stuck in the plus 40' range with tag. Even in the late used category we will be hard pressed to keep the price south of $250k to get all the features we would like and probably $450-500k new. That leaves us a pretty fair budget even if we have to drop $100k on a late model bus to start with.

As whatever coach we end up owning will be driven more than appears normal for a motorhome. My best guess is 40-50k miles annually. It seems everything in the category we are searching has quad slides. As spacious as 4 slide units are when parked they seem to completely lack functional living areas when moving. We see lots of WalMart boondocking, rest area breaks and so on so 4 slides will prove more hinderance than happiness I suspect. And honestly, quad slides is just one of the things we would do differently could we justify a Newell converion or the like. But we can't so it seems to get the coach we really want is going to take a diy approach. Also, from what I read, a bus is simply a far superior machine from the standpoint of drive quality and durability.

Advantages we have:
1.) Time. We really don't NEED a coach for about 3 years. Of course having it before would be nice but better to wait and have it be more exactly what we want.
2.) Space. I have a 20 x 60 foot space in an old industrial building just waiting for something big to get parked in it.
3.) Skills. My little business includes complete metal fabrication, small machine shop, and proffessional paint area along with people to work it all.
4.) Engineering. Both mechanical and electrical engineering types available inside.
5.) Diesel mechanics. My wife is employed by the local transit company and bakes goodies for the mechanics all the time so we have access to cheap, but not free, bus mechanics.

We lack specific experience with anything that moves down the road at 70 miles an hour though so I am a little apprehensive.

Open to any and all thoughts and advice. Feel free to talk the jumper off the ledge or nudge me to go ahead and give it a try.

Thanks

[pabusnut]

OK --maybe I am the only dumb guy reading this?!

WHAT IS A "DP"?

I know we generally call the "factory built" motorhomes S&S's  or "Stick and Staples" or "S*** and Staples" but I have never seen DP.

Down-graded Prevost
Dedicated Purpose
Deranged Plymouth
Decidedly Pitiful

This just has me stumped!

What I do know is you can buy a nice converted bus for less than $100K!

[eagle19952]

Unless your finances are in the upper tier realm, as in high 5 figure low 6, I would vote fo a conversion.
Having said that, this is a conversion weighted group
I would only wish to own a MH, if I had a need for something less than 35 foot.

PS. DP = Diesel Pusher...or more $$ motor home

[PP]

OK --maybe I am the only dumb guy reading this?!

WHAT IS A "DP"?

I know we generally call the "factory built" motorhomes S&S's  or "Stick and Staples" or "S*** and Staples" but I have never seen DP.

Down-graded Prevost
Dedicated Purpose
Deranged Plymouth
Decidedly Pitiful


This just has me stumped!

What I do know is you can buy a nice converted bus for less than $100K!

DOWN GRADED PREVOST!!??!!   There is no such animal. PERIOD 

[MaybeABus]

Unless your finances are in the upper tier realm, as in high 5 figure low 6, I would vote fo a conversion.
Having said that, this is a conversion weighted group

Budget is flexible. Currently we are anticipating $200k plus and would cry real tears if I had to exceed $300k.

Asked about opinions here because it is a conversion leaning crowd. Probably should have worded my question better. Something like why a bus instead of a pusher MH? Or why might it be foolhardy to attempt a conversion having never done it before?

My bad.

[Fred Mc]

" Or why might it be foolhardy to attempt a conversion having never done it before?"

MOST people on this board are in this category so I don't see that as a drawback.

[Oonrahnjay]

" Or why might it be foolhardy to attempt a conversion having never done it before?"

MOST people on this board are in this category so I don't see that as a drawback. 

       Just my opinion -- if you think that there's ANY chance that a completed, factory-built vehicle will meet your needs, that's where you should go.  If there's no way that a MH will work for you, or if you just really want to do something for a time-consuming, marriage-wrecking, high $$$ hobby, then you can/should consider a conversion. 

[Jon]

I am not knowledgable about MCI, but I assume like a Prevost conversion your needs will be met with a commercial bus conversion that has been professionally done.

If you want slides I recently saw a relatively late model 2 slide Prevost for $200,000 and you can buy $300,000 2 slide Prevost conversions all day long. They are all going to have from 100,000 miles to 200,000 miles so they are far from worn out and are going to give you the commercial qualities that are going to allow you to put far more the mileage you mention per year easily.

Prevost offers optional 20,000# towing capacity. Your only constraint is to keep the tongue weight below the 1500 or 2000 pound limit.

If interior space and storage plus on the road interior utility is important stay away from slides and get a late 90's or rare 2000's non slide conversion. They make the best use of space and the lack of slides actually yields more useable storage space and an interionr design that is easy to use. All slide do besides add weight, complexity, and take away storage space is provide more waling room when they are extended and less when they are closed.

[sledhead]

the best of both worlds . if you look from 2000 to 2005 you should find some high end units with 1 -2 slides and yes the 4 slide coach is great when parked but a pain in the a$$ to use when driving . what I do not like with the Newell,s is all the old style arches and the shinny curves . just my opinion there are a lot of Prevost and MCI,s out there as well  of those years


https://www.rvtrader.com/listing/2001-Newell-Coach-45--119558193

http://www.rvt.com/Prevost-American-XLll-2004-Hudson-FL-IDs7264704-UX101773

https://www.rvtrader.com/listing/1999-MCI--45-FT-Renaissance--Bus-Conversion-116780461

dave

[MaybeABus]

       Just my opinion -- if you think that there's ANY chance that a completed, factory-built vehicle will meet your needs, that's where you should go.  If there's no way that a MH will work for you, or if you just really want to do something for a time-consuming, marriage-wrecking, high $$$ hobby, then you can/should consider a conversion. 

The whole marriage wrecking idea seems a great option some days.......

[windtrader]

I'm new as well, currently searching for a bus conversion. After much analysis and extensive research, I must agree with what I was told over and over again. Buy an already converted bus conversion. Unless there is something very specific in your requirements that can only be satisfied with a totally custom build, you will save so much time, labor, headaches, and money by picking one already converted.

I feel quite up to speed with what knowledge is needed to make a smart buy. The one big unanswered topic is why are ready buyers practically non-existent. The market is incredibly biased toward buyers as reflected in the return on money spent on bus projects. One can explain away a fair portion of the expense as maintenance and repair but even improvements are nearly unrecognized in the selling prices.

From a financial perspective, you will get killed or maybe just shoot yourself if you ever sell a bus project you undertook from a bare, passenger coach. You would be fabulously delirious if you recoup 50% and thankful to almighty at 30%.

My instinct is one of the key factors is cultural and generational. My guess is the average bus nut is north of 60, the generations that actually know which end of a wrench to use and where to put it to use. Patience and hard work are familiar concepts. Millennials, on the other, have zero clue how to fix anything nor the patience, making something like a bus conversion project beyond enormous and simply unfathomable.

There are exceptions of course but they are just that, exceptions. To be fair, many boomers are more comfortable with just writing a big check to the RV dealer for a slick and shiny stick and staple factory unit. It takes an adventurous and risk taking constitution to undertake a bus conversion project, less so if one buys an already converted project. Good luck.

[PP]

The whole marriage wrecking idea seems a great option some days.......

I forgot to welcome you to the forum earlier. I like your sense of humor....

A couple of questions. You mention towing being important, but what kind of use do you see for the interior? Lots of close family, just you and the missus, or taking the employees to the races for a few days, or maybe entertaining clients? These questions will dictate a custom build, slight modifications, or just a simple factory built MH. We're all busnuts here, so you know we're biased and agree with Windtrader when he says Millennials write checks, we get our hands dirty. If you feel pride in that statement, you have to own a bus! 

[MaybeABus]

Jon, sledhead (remind me to ask about that screen name)and Windtrader. Good stuff on the "second hand pro conversions". I have just finished an hour long blitz of rvtrader and youtube.

Seems what we really are looking for may well lie in that particular pile. Though I am still intrigued by the possibility of a wrecked marriage over a bus, I suppose I am getting older as now it would take a machine to be the homewrecker.

[Oonrahnjay]

.. now it would take a machine to be the homewrecker.

      Much less subsequent heartache than a red-head.

[MaybeABus]

PP, you hit the nail on the head. All the uses you mention and a few more. The towing capacity comes from a machine we are building in Chicago. The smallest model comes in at about 7000 pounds. Add in a car, supplies to support demonstrating the machine on site and the necessary custom trailer and I expect to end up a bit north of 15K pounds. If 15k is all I can come up with I guess I'd dump the car.

The coach will find it's way to trade shows on some days. Other times it will take myself and my grandson who is a roller coaster fanatic to whatever amusement park he has his heart set on. That's the problem with being 300 miles away from him, I kinda spoil him when we do get together. It will also be used for the two of us to get away for weeks at a time. So as I said, all the above. It will very much be a multipurpose vehicle.

And it might house me and my dog when she throws me out for a few nights at a time.

And Oonrahnjay it would never have been a redhead, I am far too cowardly for one of those.

Thanks for the welcome.