Author Topic: Sign Panel Skin Buckled  (Read 1089 times)

Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #30 on: May 17, 2019, 01:51:23 PM »
Luvrbus

I hate to hear that.  I enjoy reading your posts and your advice is excellent.  If someone as knowledgeable as you calls it quits perhaps I am already to far into something I won't be able to manage.  I remember reading a thread a while ago about someone who was considering quitting because of the problems he was having.  I read all the encouragement this forum was giving him.  Then I looked at his profile and he is still with it and that was years ago.  I guess we just need to take it slow, take a brake when needed and tackle one thing at a time.  I sure would hate to see you quit. 

Jared

quote author=luvrbus link=topic=34009.msg390064#msg390064 date=1558100403]
Most people don't try to repair those areas it is to much work they sell to Craylor for a few thousand and let him scrap it out.I have about reached that point on mine where they raised the roof and installed the  double pane windows all the welds are broken loose if they were ever welded after 3 years work and many dollars I am calling it quits I am going to part the thing out and buying a RV. DAMN I hate defeat !!!!
[/quote]

Offline buswarrior

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #31 on: May 17, 2019, 02:07:13 PM »
Busnut duty does not require Smithsonian level reconditioning, unless that is what drives you...

Open it up, see what you've got, patch 'er up and GO CAMPING.

Laying up the coach is deadly to morale, motivation and family support for this wild idea.

I repeat, GO CAMPING.

Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
Frozen North, Greater Toronto Area

Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #32 on: May 17, 2019, 02:37:27 PM »
Here are a couple pics looking down the side of the bus at it's mid rail.  It dosen't look like there is an arch, rather just a bulge outward where the skin is no longer fastened to the side.  Of course there is rust behind that panel.  I will just have to see when I take it apart.  But it dosen't look like to me there is sagging or arching above the wheel area.  What are your thoughts?



Jared, bulging/sagging sides is unfortunately a common occurance on the DL's. Stand at the front corner and look down the belt line and you will probably see an arch over the rear axles, signs of underlying structural damage and weakness. If the sides are bulging its a good indicator of underlying rust issues as others have said. When I was looking for a bus before I bought mine, I looked at several that I could put my hand through the sides by the rear axles. I paid more than I care to admit for my bus, but I felt comfortable doing so because after thorough close inspection the body appeared to be in excellent condition with barely even any surface rust. I can look down the belt line and see no sag or droop.

Offline richard5933

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #33 on: May 17, 2019, 02:52:47 PM »
You might possibly have a frame member on the other side of that panel that's rusted and pushing out against it. Can you get a look at it from the inside? If you haven't gutted that section, get one of the endoscopes from Amazon for $30 and use it to poke around inside the wall.
Richard
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1964 GM PD4106-2412 (Former Bus)
Located in beautiful Wisconsin
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Offline sledhead

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2019, 04:04:13 PM »
when I got my mci the driver side had been repaired and the passenger side look great for about 5 years . then I noticed the bulge start and after about 1 year the rust started showing on the outside at the belt line . I cut about 6 " up from the belt line for about 5 ' and removed the outside panel . I found that there was a small amount of rust on the vertical frame and ground it off and used fluid film on it  to stop the rust . I found that the bulge was more from dirt and crap that was pushing on the outside skin and the shitty foam insulation from mci . I cut out the foam and spray foamed the area . then I cut and welded in the 6" x 5' piece of 18 gauge satin coat galvanized steel and did some bondo and primer then I painted the area . then reinstalled the rubber belt line . after it was all done it looked great . never had any problems again . as this is what they did to repair it at the bus co on the other side years ago .
as I did it all myself the cost was only about $ 150 

it's not the end of the world . get in and drive it

steel will always rust eventually just fix it and move on
 
dave     
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 04:10:00 PM by sledhead »
dave , karen
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Offline Jim Blackwood

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #35 on: May 17, 2019, 05:31:12 PM »
On mine, I'm not going to worry about it until I have to. I can see where the panel is being pushed out a little but there's no signs of any separation any time soon. I just wonder how feasible it'd be to detach the bottom seam, pull it out a bit and clean it up in behind the panel?

Jim
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Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2019, 10:06:40 PM »
Jim
When I pull the panel off I will take a bunch of pics and post them.  Perhaps the corrosion behind mine will be similar to yours.

On mine, I'm not going to worry about it until I have to. I can see where the panel is being pushed out a little but there's no signs of any separation any time soon. I just wonder how feasible it'd be to detach the bottom seam, pull it out a bit and clean it up in behind the panel?

Jim

Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #37 on: July 11, 2019, 07:15:47 PM »
Ok, so I finally got around to pulling off the sign panel to see what was pushing it out.  I was hoping it was something obvious.  Let me just confirm that the panel is very heavy.  Anyhow, I was surprised to see nothing that would make the panel buckle.  No corrosion or trash that would push it out, so my best guess is there must be some structural damage underneath by the drive and tag axle and the bus is actually weak or sagging.  Just like someone said.  My question is, how do I find the problem and how do I fix the problem?  Here are some pics of the buckle and what it looks like under the panel.

On mine, I'm not going to worry about it until I have to. I can see where the panel is being pushed out a little but there's no signs of any separation any time soon. I just wonder how feasible it'd be to detach the bottom seam, pull it out a bit and clean it up in behind the panel?

Jim

Offline Astro

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #38 on: July 11, 2019, 08:43:53 PM »
I would suggest what your seeing is the outside metal is slowly being stretched by body flex into creating an oil can at the flex point.  We saw this many times in my aviation career on airplanes.  Unless you have definitive evidence if corrosion or rust, the best bet is to leave it alone unless your OCD gets the best of you.  Oil canning skin on bus is not much more than unsightly.  An airplane is another story......
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 09:30:58 PM by Astro »
Ken
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Offline chessie4905

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2019, 04:15:05 AM »
If the coach, at some time  in the past has backed or pulled into something, the panel above the wheel wells can bulge or buckle some, as that is the weakest point on the body.
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Offline Jim Blackwood

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2019, 05:53:00 AM »
Very likely the reason why I have some (very slight) bulges on mine above the wheels. Goes along with the damage to the rear bumper.

So here's another thing for you wannabees to watch out for. Good info to be fore-armed with when bus shopping.

Personally, I don't care. I was always a 'function over form' kinda guy anyway.

Jim
Information, without Knowledge, is useless.

Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #41 on: July 12, 2019, 07:17:22 AM »
So the rear bumper is damaged so I am assuming that they were struck or backed into something.  What would be the best way to fix this?  If I cut a few inches off the length of the panel and reinstalled it would that solve the buckle?

If the coach, at some time  in the past has backed or pulled into something, the panel above the wheel wells can bulge or buckle some, as that is the weakest point on the body.

Offline Jim Blackwood

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2019, 07:22:12 AM »
Chain it to a loading dock and pull forward maybe? (The way we used to straighten bumpers back in the old days. Crude but effective.)

Seems pretty clear that my bus was backed into something at some point, and that they pulled the rear frame section back out to correct it. The section under the rear doors is not straight. It has some bends in it where it was apparently pulled back out in the middle. and the wear marks from the doors no longer line up. The way the rear bumper is faired in to the body doesn't look quite right either. But, the engine seems to be fine and the bulges over the rear wheels are only just visible. I'm pretty sure I'd do more harm than good trying to pull them back straight. But, I may give it a try some day.

Jim
Information, without Knowledge, is useless.

Offline Jcparmley

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2019, 04:31:17 PM »
I am thinking about skinning over the entire side of the bus rather than reinstalling the original side panels.  THose original panels are super heavy.  Anyhow, do you think if I install new panels they will develope the same buckle as before?  when I remove the floor I plan on welding in some new steel to support the drive and the tag axle.  What do you all think?

Offline bigred

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Re: Sign Panel Skin Buckled
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2019, 04:51:19 PM »
The thing that is really setting off alarms for me is the fact that you said ithas bulge on each side in the same place which makes me wonder if it took a hard enough lick to buckle it. Someone ,anyone is this possible??
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