MPG redux

[47hound]

I'll try to make this simple.  The US government no longer allows us to extract our own oil out of our own soil.  So now we buy the oil we need from despots and tyrants.  This increases said dictators' war chests.  In turn, allowing them to finance bloody wars.  This is not on accident. Eighteen months ago we produced more petroleum than we used, so we were able to export crude for profit, which allowed us some control over crude prices.  Now we are reliant on oil gangsters to supply our nation's energy.   Oil companies have no control over crude futures when they're not able to create supply.  Put the blame squarely where it belongs.  What changed a year and a half ago besides the current potatus?(potato in chief).   Patrick

[Nova Eona]

As with most problems within a capitalist society, the root cause can be found if you follow the money.  Where is most of that money going?  Not into the pockets of Joe Biden or even the average Californian Democrat (*boo*, *hiss*, I guess) but into those of the oil companies and related American Oligarchs.

Now, I don't begrudge capitalism as a concept, but when you have a handful of highly profitable companies with a cartel (let's call a spade a spade here) which benefit from taxpayer-funded subsidies while using those same profits to buy politicians and oppose any research or policies which could endanger their grip on the energy market or even address the environmental damage of their operations, that is not sustainable in the long-term or good for the average citizen.

In a healthy market, prices at the pump would be tied to acquisition and production costs, not a vague metric of 'how much they think they can get away with'.  (Yes individual gas stations have thin profit margins, but only because the skimming happens earlier in the chain)  All y'all talking about taxes, where the oil comes from, what Biden wants, etc. are missing the key point that oil company profits are through the roof; if any of those factors was the main reason for gas price increases, we would not be seeing profit surges as they 'pass the cost' to us.  Surging profits absent related demand or competitive value point to price gouging, plain and simple.

[luvrbus]

LOL Walmart and Amazon both make more money than any oil company  in the US

[Nova Eona]

LOL Walmart and Amazon both make more money than any oil company  in the US

If I were trying to describe how Ted Bundy is a serial killer, pointing out John Wayne Gacy's higher body count doesn't exactly invalidate the original argument.

[TomC]

If you don't have the App on your phone, install GasGuru. It tells the cheapest wherever you are.

[richard5933]

I'll try to make this simple.  The US government no longer allows us to extract our own oil out of our own soil.  So now we buy the oil we need from despots and tyrants.  This increases said dictators' war chests.  In turn, allowing them to finance bloody wars.  This is not on accident. Eighteen months ago we produced more petroleum than we used, so we were able to export crude for profit, which allowed us some control over crude prices.  Now we are reliant on oil gangsters to supply our nation's energy.   Oil companies have no control over crude futures when they're not able to create supply.  Put the blame squarely where it belongs.  What changed a year and a half ago besides the current potatus?(potato in chief).   Patrick

Please show some facts to back this up.

We recently drove from Wisconsin to New Mexico and passed countless pump jacks in action, natural gas wells in action, etc.

[richard5933]

...All y'all talking about taxes, where the oil comes from, what Biden wants, etc. are missing the key point that oil company profits are through the roof; if any of those factors was the main reason for gas price increases, we would not be seeing profit surges as they 'pass the cost' to us.  Surging profits absent related demand or competitive value point to price gouging, plain and simple.

Thanks for making the point so well.

I've been asking for a while for people to look to see where all the higher costs were going - if crude oil is now selling for 50% more than last month, then someone in the crude oil business is making a windfall while the rest of of suffer paying their "market prices" for fuel.

Even a hint of a fear of lowered supply sends commodity markets into crazy mode - suppliers make out like bandits and we pay the bill.

[buswarrior]

Purchase oil company shares and cash in on the winnings?

Oh, never mind...

Happy coaching!
Buswarrior

[fortyniner]

Oil refiners like Exxon,Chevron and others buy their oil on the open market they are not selling oil but a finished product how are they the blame, our energy dept of the FED  screwed this up fuel in Needles CA was $6.59 a gal buy 200 gals of that

I remember way back in Carter admin how the oil companies held tankers offshore and claimed shortage was greater than it was. They are expert at market manipulation as well as public opinion manipulation ie: Herb Schmertz  a true genius at shaping public opinion.

[luvrbus]

Purchase oil company shares and cash in on the winnings?

Oh, never mind...

Happy coaching!
Buswarrior

Funny I got my yearly check from Chevron the 1st of the year,when I looked at it WTH the check was written on the bank of China.I want someone to tell me where the out fits like Chevron and Exxon proifts come from,it dosen't all come from fuel most profits come from their chemical divisons and other divisions, oil companies are not the problem

[luvrbus]

I remember way back in Carter admin how the oil companies held tankers offshore and claimed shortage was greater than it was. They are expert at market manipulation as well as public opinion manipulation ie: Herb Schmertz  a true genius at shaping public opinion.

The price of toilet paper now is blamed on shortages,the oil in the tankers belonged to Armaco that were off shore back in the Carter oil embargo and they would not let it be unloaded   

[richard5933]

Funny I got my yearly check from Chevron the 1st of the year,when I looked at it WTH the check was written on the bank of China.I want someone to tell me where the out fits like Chevron and Exxon proifts come from,it dosen't all come from fuel most profits come from their chemical divisons and other divisions, oil companies are not the problem

How do you figure?

Oil companies pump crude from the ground and sell it to their own holding companies and to other companies.

The oil that they were pumping recently for less than $50/barrel is now selling for over $100/barrel. I doubt that their costs of production have gone up more than a few cents/barrel since then, so all the rest is straight up profit (or price gouging, depending on who you ask.)

[luvrbus]

How do you figure?

Oil companies pump crude from the ground and sell it to their own holding companies and to other companies.

The oil that they were pumping recently for less than $50/barrel is now selling for over $100/barrel. I doubt that their costs of production have gone up more than a few cents/barrel since then, so all the rest is straight up profit (or price gouging, depending on who you ask.)

Let me ask you this should a US oil producer sell his oil cheaper that he has to pay for oil.Pumping oil the pumps jacks on shallow oil wells it takes 1000 of those to pump enough oil in a day for a truck load and maintance to pump that oil is pricey.and natural gas wells you tell if producing gas with out going to well head not driving by,put the blame where it belongs,if DC can take the credit for cheap fuel then they take credit for high prices IMO   

[richard5933]

Let me ask you this should a US oil producer sell his oil cheaper that he has to pay for oil.Pumping oil the pumps jacks on shallow oil wells it takes 1000 of those to pump enough oil in a day for a truck load and maintance to pump that oil is pricey.and natural gas wells you tell if producing gas with out going to well head not driving by,put the blame where it belongs,if DC can take the credit for cheap fuel then they take credit for high prices IMO

You're missing my point completely.

You're also conflating the part of the oil industry that buys crude with the part that refines it into fuels. Of course the refineries need to pass their increased crude prices along to consumers, and that's not at all what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about the price the crude oil people are getting for their crude oil.

The price crude oil sells for on the open market is not at all connected with the actual cost of bringing it up out of the ground.

When crude oil futures double in price do you really think that means that the cost of production suddenly doubled? Of course not - it's only changed because the market forces were such that produced the increase in value.

Oil companies are pumping oil from the exact same wells around the world today as they were a month ago (except possibly inside Russia at the moment) and the cost of production today isn't that much different than it was then. But the market forces (fear of shortage of supply, etc) have raised market prices for crude oil to well over $100 suddenly.

Most oil companies we commonly refer to by a single name (BP, Exxon, etc.) are actually made up of various divisions and sub-companies. The people that pump the oil from the ground may be called BP, and the people pumping gasoline into your tank may also be working for BP, but in between the two there are at least a few internal sales of the product along the way and at each sale BP is making additional profit.

[luvrbus]

With prices today I don't know about 50% but it is costing a lot more now to produce oil than a year ago,our cheap under 2 bucks a gal fuel is gone ,it will level off in a few years at above or around $4.00 a gal