Backing at night

[Hodag]

Does anybody have a secret for eliminating stray reflections on the mirrors that make backing at night very difficult?  I could drive backward down a freeway and parallel park at the mall during the day, but at night the reflections on the mirrors are disorienting and obscure my view.  I'm sure my neighbors at the campground this weekend thought I had a few drinks before pulling in.  I have the standard Ramco mirrors on my Prevost XL.  I belive the culprit is light reflecting from outside the bus, hitting the dual pane side windows and then reflecting the image back onto the mirrors.  It is worse in snow, like I had this weekend.  I turn off every single interior light, even the dash, and use only the exterior running and docking lights (headlights off), but its still really bad.  Any tips from you truckers?  Buswarrior?  Thanks.

Bryan

[jjrbus]

Backup camera, only way to go!!

[belfert]

I find my backup camera doesn't show things in the right spots.  If I depended on my camera exclusively without the mirrors I would hit things.  I need to adjust the camera or something.

At home I will not back in after dark.  I pull in forward far enough to get off the street and wait until daylight.  I have to back up a good 200 feet on a 10 foot wide driveway that has a 12 inch dropoff on one side.  I have only about 6 inches clearance when I go by my porch.  (Yes, I hit the porch once with my travel trailer, but the bus is much easier.)

[buswarrior]

Hello Bryan

Backing in the dark is challenging, and doesn't get any better as our eyes age.

For the driver's side, a piece of cardboard from the back of a pad of paper and simply held by hand in the strategic position to block the cross-bus glare helps. I keep one in the slot where the driver used to keep his paperwork.

Many buses don't let you open the window to get that piece of glass out of the way, so that option is only available to those with big openers.

The curb side mirror is a real challenge by yourself.

Of course, clean windows, in and out is important. Smokers will have to use the Windex/Bon Ami regularly to keep that hazy film at bay. Night time glare really shows up windows that aren't clean.

And, of course, remember, never worry about how long it takes to make a clean manoeuvre.

Real men have a GOAL:  "Get Out And Look"

I might suggest we have to defend against the boy in all of us has something to prove...
I don't know a male who doesn't....

The flashing turn signals down the side of the coach may give you brief snapshots of slightly better clarity, but then may dazzle if there is rain on the windows and the mirror, so a mixed blessing.

It can also help to have an assistant out with a good flashlight to illuminate your path, (not shine it at you, you've seen them out the back of the RV shining the light at the mirrors, blinding the driver) The assitant needs to be somewhere more forward and aiming it back at your target points or the obstructions, as your needs dictate.

A permanent solution to independent night time backing is adding some better lighting down the side or at the rear of the coach, similar to what the truckers do with rear facing lights.

Even a good bright light in a traditional back-up light can make a difference , if the rear stands out bright in your mirrors, cutting through the glare.

Go out somewhere in the dark and do some experiments with an assistant, a ladder, and a combination of bulbs or fixtures on a long wire and have them hold it in various places you are willing to mount it and see if you like the results. Pay particular attention that you don't mount it where it will cast illumination onto the mirror, negating some of its benefit.

You might be surprised how little changes you might make to suit your needs. Even one of those neat fixtures on transit buses mounted to either side of the doors down low that illuminate the ground when the door is open with a plain bulb in it makes a world of difference.

Have some concern in your mounting design for how you might protect higher side mounted ones from meeting untimely removal by dragging tree branches.

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[buswarrior]

Ooops, an update:

The ultimate Real Man waits until daylight.

Good plan, and secure in his manhood!

Back up camera only helps with what it is aimed at and what it shows. It won't keep you from dragging or swinging the side of the coach into something, which is a way more prevalent reversing accident than actually striking something with the back bumper.

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[grantgoold]

If backing at night and the camera doesn't work or we do not trust the camera then we use the following procedure.

First, get out and walk around the area you are about to back up in.
Second, identify spots or issues that may get the bus stuck or someone injured.
Third, get out the little hand held walkie talkies. Turn off inside lighting. Let eyes adjust.
Fourth, backer turns on flashlight and uses only agreed upon signals along with voice prompts.
Fifth, go slow!
Sixth, go slow!
Seventh, if any serious problems are considered or a real possibility of injury. Stop wait until sunlight or move to a better location.

[Hodag]

Thanks, all.  Very good advice.  Erudite as always, Buswarrior!  I have a b/u camera, but, as noted, it only shows what is directly behind me, not the sides, and it is hard to judge distances.   

Seems no matter how I plan my trip, I never get "there" until after dark, no matter where "there" is.

Bryan

[Dallas]

If backing at night and the camera doesn't work or we do not trust the camera then we use the following procedure.

First, get out and walk around the area you are about to back up in.
Second, identify spots or issues that may get the bus stuck or someone injured.
Third, get out the little hand held walkie talkies. Turn off inside lighting. Let eyes adjust.
Fourth, backer turns on flashlight and uses only agreed upon signals along with voice prompts.
Fifth, go slow!
Sixth, go slow!
Seventh, if any serious problems are considered or a real possibility of injury. Stop wait until sunlight or move to a better location.

Between First and Second.... LOOK UP! Here There Be Trees!

[belfert]

I never answered your the question about reflections in the mirrors.

The main part of my driver's window slides open unlike a lot of buses.  I just open the window and the reflections in the mirror usually go away.  I'm actually seeing reflections from the window, not the mirror.

[Lin]

Do you think that inspecting the area and laying something like a bright yellow caution ribbon on the driver's side could be used as a guide to follow?    You would still use the spotter if available, but also know that you had to stay within a couple of feet of the ribbon.  If it were in a campground and electricity was available, you could use a string of cheap Christmas lights as landing markers.

[TomC]

I can't tell you how many times when backing I would set the parking brake and get out to look behind at the situation-even with someone there spotting for me.  Back up cameras help, but nothing beats getting out for a looksee.  Good Luck, TomC

[tekebird]

the small chemlights for fishing lures.

[Len Silva]

I always walk the site first, day or night. I keep an orange traffic cone that I put where I want the left rear corner to end up.  Try to always back in from the left side.  If you have an assistant, be sure to understand and practice your communications.  Even with radios, if your helper is saying "right, right, right", does that mean move the rear of the coach to the right, or turn the wheel to the right, or just always be right  .

With my wife ( and the traffic cone), the instructions are to always be able to see me in the left mirror and only tell me to stop if I'm going to hit something. That doesn't do much for your night time situation.

I have very bright back-up lights and turn off all the coach lights.  I sometimes put a flashlight inside my traffic cone.

Len

[BusMom]

Speaking from the outside spotters position make sure your communication with the driver is good.  We use hand signals when backing our bus up.  Since I used to park aircraft when I was in the military I just adopted those hand signals.  If we are parking at night I use a flashlight and the same signals.  Just try out a couple of different ideas that have been posted here on a night (preferably someplace you are familiar with) and see what works best for you.

[Hodag]

Thanks for all the suggestions.  I especially like the cone idea.  Yes, I always get out and walk the site before backing and I have installed a set of bright fog lights under my rear bumper, but my problem is seeing out through all the stray reflections bouncing off the windows and mirrors.  It's like seeing double or triple in the mirrors and really hard to figure out which is the true view.  Very disorienting.   The cone with flashlight inside will probably be bright enough to cut through the reflections to show what I am truly looking at.  I will also try the cardboard glare blocker suggested by Buswarrior.  Brian, opening the window is the right idea, but does not work for me.  On my bus, the driver window is split vertically, and opens from rear to front. So if I open the window I now have the reflections off four layers of glass before I see the mirror.  Somebody wasn't thinking when they designed that! Thanks again.

Bryan