bus not level when air up

[compedgemarine]

I dont have air suspension on mine but I know a small amount about it. you said it was just at the Allison dealer and now it leans. I assume that it was fine when it went? what did the dealer do to it? yes it is possible that something was disconnected or a valve was closed or something. if it was fine prior to it being at the dealership then there is a good chance they forgot to reset something or hook up a leveling valve when they finished up. I have run into problems like that before when having something worked on. dont Panic. before the bus existed it was a bunch of steel and parts and someone put it all together. there is nothing on it that someone (you) cant fix or put back together with a little guidence.
steve

[skipn]

Bowmaga,

    Sorry I only have an MC8  but lets just get things set up first.
 What NJT5047 (JR) and Sammy said was a good start if that didn't connect with you....... let's start over.

  SAFETY First.
     Block the wheels.
     Proper Jacks at the proper places......put weight on the jacks......well that was easy.
     Check to make sure the jacks are not sinking....if they are get bigger cribbing to disperse the weight.
     next do you have an air compressor.......it will help with the diagnoses.

  OK the situation is "Air bags won't inflat"    
   Only 2 basic reasons
       1. A leak..................aired up with the compressor someone with good ears should be able to hear the leak
       2. Something is plugged............harder to find but usually means a need for a good cleaning and proper maintenance.

   On the passenger side back engine door should be a male air connector. Hook your air line there fill it to 100# and
  listen for leaks..........CHECK THE JACKS! (your bus could have moved higher making the jacks vulnerable)
   

    If you can hear leaks then #2 is probably ruled out.

    Now it is time to pin point the leak.
    CHECK the JACKS and block it up before crawling under.
    NEVER stick your head between the wheel and body. Use light weight plastic tubing
     to push around to where you want to listen to. (oh and one end in your ear)
    Check all lines
    check air bags
    check the valves.


   I hope this helps take a deep breath  you have a couple of days before the storm hits.

    Please be safe

    Skip

[hiwaycallin]

... Use light weight plastic tubing
     to push around to where you want to listen to. (oh and one end in your ear) ...

Skip, that's brilliant! A low-tech remote controlled bionic ear 

[bowmaga]

I can't find anywhere in my manual that tells me where to put the proper jacks in the proper places.  Thanks for the advice, I need more specifics if there are any.  Don't assume I know anything.  I'm going to back my bus up to my garage and start working on her.  I'm gonna fix this.  I have some jack stands and some jacks.  The Allison dealership told us they didn't think she had any air leaks.  That's why I'm baffled that she's sitting this way.  I don't think its an air leak issue.  its an issue air just isn't getting to that side or something.  I can't say if this was like this before...i just bought the bus and last night was the first night it spent at my house.  I didn't expect problems so early in out relationship.

[skipn]

Bowmaga,

    Personally 10k# won't cut it I think most of the guys on the board use 10 Ton jacks
 and the jackstands should be that beefy. The suspension part of the maintenance
 manual is where it says to place the jack.

  REMEmBER you are jacking up the suspension not just the bus so if the air bags/lines
 have a major failure the bus will drop like a lead balloon that is why you don't
 stick body parts between the suspension and the rest of the bus!

   You are only jacking it up so you can get under it and not be crushed if there
 is a failure!   RAMPS work very well there are links on the board on how to
 build them.

 Hiway..........one learns to compensate for age.

 Skip

[chazwood]

My mc9  leans whenever she feels like it. I think she's lazy. I notice it's the worst when I don't take her out for about 2 weeks. (just like my wife... )  I left for a 900 mile trip to arkansas and she leaned for so long that when she finally straighten up....it felt weird.

I do notice that if she's been sitting for a week or so and I take off as soon as the low air light flicks off (90 psi.) and I don't let it get up to 120 pounds pressure for a little bit... she's more prone to lean.

One time I noticed the big lean and walked around the bus to peek at the other side, just about the time I did, the relief valve blasted telling me she was up to 120. I immediately walked back around to the first side I had looked at, and it was up. weird.

I wouldn't get too wound up about it. (although I did at first )
The more you use it, the less she acts up.....remember, these things were designed to never shut down.
I've never seen a happy greyhound sitting in a cage or on a chain.
Run it. Let her feel the wind in her teeth......
I promise, if you cut her loose often enough, she will do you right.

chazwood.

[chazwood]

Ps. Don't repeat that remark about my wife....If she gets wind of it..... I'm toast.

[chazwood]

I can't find anywhere in my manual that tells me where to put the proper jacks in the proper places.  Thanks for the advice, I need more specifics if there are any.  Don't assume I know anything.  I'm going to back my bus up to my garage and start working on her.  I'm gonna fix this.  I have some jack stands and some jacks.  The Allison dealership told us they didn't think she had any air leaks.  That's why I'm baffled that she's sitting this way.  I don't think its an air leak issue.  its an issue air just isn't getting to that side or something.  I can't say if this was like this before...i just bought the bus and last night was the first night it spent at my house.  I didn't expect problems so early in out relationship.

Go to harbor freight (if you want to die) and buy a thirty ton chinese bottle jack. (Cheap....but they want to kill us. Your choice.) Get on your back and scoot under your bus......try not to get greasy
Look Right behind your front wheels for a square piece of steel tubing, pointing straight at the ground......this is your jack point. I use a 4 inch square piece of 1/2 inch plate on top of my bottle jack. Look for the same thing at the back wheels.

[NJT5047]

Assuming an MC8 is similar to an MC9, the rear jack points are a small flange welded to the frontmost aspect of the vertical steel post to which the drive axle suspension is attached.
This is just in front of the drive axle wheels. 
If you jack less than about 5", you will not be lifting the drive axle and suspension components...so whether or not the bus is aired won't have any effect on what you're doing.  Jacking more than about 10" will extend the shock enough to top-out the shock and then lift the drive axle.  This really twists the bus and probably should be avoided.  Twist it enough and you may break, or pop out windshields.  They will definitely shift in the windshields in the frame if the bus is twisted enough.  Popping out isn't really likely on an MCI.  Eagle windshields will.
I would not lift the bus that far with the jacking points.  Take up about 3" or enough to take the load off the suspension.  Then use a small jack to lift the drive axle.  No need to lift the duals any more than enough to pass a coat hanger or paper beneath them.   
Never lift or jack the bus with the suspension components...axles, beams, or any thing else other than the jack point or bottom of wheels (ramps). 
Don't let the tags hang over ramps.  Support the tags. 
Compressing them doesn't seem to cause any problems.  Or, you can dump the tag bags.
Unless the bus is blocked on concrete, I wouldn't get under it period...generally.
Be careful with ramps on dirt.  They'll turn over and smush you.  Be careful with jacks on asphalt too.  Jacks will punch right thru asphalt.   A piece of 12" X 12" steel plate will make jacking safer.
I forget which bus we're talking about now?  Someone's been posting about an MCI that has the wheel wells sitting on the tires.  If this is part of the problem, the bus can be jacked up, and a block of wood placed between the suspension and the chassis to move it short distance at very slow speeds (around the yard).  Blocks are something like oak or cut cross ties. 
When the air bags are working normally, jacking the bus to remove wheels is easy.  Air it up, just set the jack under the jack point, extend so that it is against the jack point, and bleed the air out of the bus.  It'll give you 5" of jacking without any effort.  Don't jack on the axles unless the air is bled out and the bus body is jacked up. 
JR

[bowmaga]

chazwood.  Doesn't that lean put a lot of pressure on the side its leaning to's wheels?  Wouldn't that be bad on it?  I still haven't figured anything out.....my next step might be a for sale sign.

[skipn]

Bowmaga,

    Tell you what Dallas is/was 4hrs south of you. PM him/call and hire him
 to come up and help you fix the bus and answer/teach you about your
 bus

   It would probably be the best bus money you will ever spend.
  One day with Dallas will save you 6 months of pulling your hair out


    Skip

[chazwood]

chazwood.  Doesn't that lean put a lot of pressure on the side its leaning to's wheels?  Wouldn't that be bad on it?  I still haven't figured anything out.....my next step might be a for sale sign.

Well, If I had new rubber I might be more concerned....but the bus spends its life leaning one way or another, so it can't be all that bad....just a little disconcerting at first.

By the way......I'm hoping you might pinpoint the problem so you can tell me how to fix it.   If you quit on me now....how will I ever know? 

I would pay closer attention to fixing it myself but as I mentioned before ....the problem goes away if you use it often. I noticed it all the time when I first bought the bus, (it had been sitting for a year)  it happened off and on for about a month. But ever since I returned from the "Little Biggie" adventure (read about it in future articles ) The old gal sits straighter than a nun at a frat party.


My advice? Ignore it for now.....move on to other things that need attention.....drive it as often as you can.... see if it disapears on it's own like mine did. But, if you must know....and do discover the cause, by all means,  share with the rest of us.

[chazwood]

Furthermore, and not withstanding.....( I've never been able to figure out exactly what that means, but it sounds cool ) The longer you operate these old gals the more you realise why we call them Gals.....it's because they take a very long time to warm up. The older they get the longer they take. (let me rephrase that... the older yours gets the longer she takes...I don't have that problem.... ) It takes at least a 100 miles of wide open before she get in a good mood. If you only drive her around the block she will complain. ("kiss me first" comes to mind) These ladies require a certain amount of commitment before they perform well.....Dang, this little chat is beginning to take on a rather seedy tone....)sorry Ladies (


I guess what I'm trying to say is ....I feel your pain, but....don't get discouraged.....don't get impatient....don't give up.....someday, you will be very glad you married her. And if you're like me ...it will be soon.

[chazwood]

Well?....how's it going?

[jlaney]

hello from texas
my old scenicruiser. did this as i drove down the road. found that the duct tape
which someone use to hold the leveling arms for the rear airbag came loose.
duct tape works on almost everything.  j.t.