Author Topic: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier  (Read 4194 times)

Offline Michael_e

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Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« on: July 25, 2008, 09:23:16 AM »
First - CHAZ, i didn't want to highjack your thread by focusing on a Scenicrusier.

Second - I'll try not to sound too stupid with my question...

On the back engine door of Scenicrusiers is a window that has shutters. There was an air valve on mine, but it was disconnected. I don't know where the air line went or how it was controlled. But it was there for a reason. To help remove heat from the engine compartment, couldn't a person hook up a control valve to open those shutters and add some sort of auto radiator electric fan to quickly get the hot air out, thus reduce overall engine temperatures? Maybe add some sort of engine compartment temperature gauge to know how hot it gets back there? I'm sure that turbo and exhaust piping add a lot of heat when going up a hill.

Mike
1955 GM Scenicrusier, 8V92TA & Allison 754. Totally rewiring all 12v systems and lots of questions.

Offline Chaz

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2008, 09:48:39 AM »
Thanx Mike!  :)  Your concern is appreciated.
Wish I could help you on your issue. I'm even LESS versed on Scenics than my Buffalo!!  :D But my guess is that the shutters are for helping warm the motor up when it's cold out. I would have thought that they should be open when it's warm out. Was it fastened open?

  Chaz
Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
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Offline roadrunnertex

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2008, 10:09:16 AM »
Scenicruisers / Buffalos?
Chaz P8M4108A has a 8V/71 non turbo engine so that's not a heat problem.
The Scenicruiser had the same style engine 8V/71 non turbo also but on the Scenicruisers you had the condenser for the A/C system on the right rear corner of the engine compartment adding heat to the area on a summer day.
The rear engine compartment access door had a opening with louvers but they were always open and if I recall they did not open and shut with the radiator shutter system.
The problem I think that Chaz is having is the extra heat from the V730 automatic transmission and Chaz is heading in the right direction by installing a air to oil heat exchanger on the V730 cooling system.
Hope I did not confuse the over heat issue for you Chaz.
jlv

Offline Chaz

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2008, 10:20:03 AM »
Not at all Tex, I appreciate all your insight!!

But, on the scenic, are those shutters open all the time when to bus is operating, or did they sense the heat and open accordingly?  (I'm just curious now. :))

Thanx
Chaz
Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein

Offline roadrunnertex

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2008, 11:12:34 AM »
After talking to Derf our noted Scenicruiser historian in Oklahoma City,OK.
He stated that the louvered opening on the rear engine compartment door were not connected to the Shutterstat system for the radiator.
You could manually open them in the summer or manually close them for winter operation.
jlv

Offline kyle4501

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2008, 11:32:30 AM »
I'd put a temp sensor back there & see what it's doing before adding more gadgets.  ;D

Also, is the lower full width flap still there below the rear bulkhead? If not, you'll get lots more benefit from replacing it than a small fan on the rear door.

Is your condenser still back there? Or has it been replaced with a generator like most do . . . .



My guess is that if you install an exhaust gas temp gauge, you'd be able to control the engine temp easier by keeping the EGT in an acceptable range.  ;D
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Offline Hartley

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2008, 12:50:03 PM »
That 600 pound radiator should keep it cold no matter what kind of louvers
you have. You need to remember they originally had 2-engines back there!

Too bad nobody saved one of those setups as an example.

That would be an interesting "GREEN" project. One engine for cruising
and both for get the heck outta my way times....

( Yeah.. I know the combiner wouldn't do that...GM go figure? )

Or Diesel for in town and Gas Turbine or electric for highway... Hmmm...

Never take a knife to a gunfight!

Offline kyle4501

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2008, 01:20:06 PM »
& the 2 engine setup had rear mounted radiators, a fluid drive connecting the engines, a 3 speed transmission & a 2 speed clutch. No wonder the mechanics didn't like them.  :o

A lot of stuff was changed in the early 60's with that first rebuild that installed the 8V71 & 4 speed.  8)
Life is all about finding people who are your kind of crazy

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Offline Don Fairchild

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2008, 02:46:00 PM »
And some of them they put 12V71N's in, I have seen three in the Bakersfield area and worked on two of them. I under stand that conversion was done in Canada some where.

Don

Offline Michael_e

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2008, 03:31:43 PM »
Gad Zooks, a 12V71!!!!! Was there some sort of extention on the back? I can't imagine that fitting in there without something sticking out the back. Wait a minute, are you seeing if i'll bit on this whopper?? Is this April 1 all over again?

Mike
1955 GM Scenicrusier, 8V92TA & Allison 754. Totally rewiring all 12v systems and lots of questions.

Offline tekebird

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2008, 03:39:21 PM »
I do not know of any 12v71 scenicruisers that had a 12 in them while greyhound had them.

there were mack powered Scenics, Mack powered 4104's, a MAN powered Scenic and a few other repower test beds.


Offline roadrunnertex

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2008, 04:14:18 PM »
I bet that the 12V/71's was in the MC-6's that Greyhound was going to us to replace the Scenicruisers.
They came from MCI new with the 12V/71 engines.
jlv

Offline Don Fairchild

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2008, 04:41:18 PM »
JL, Doug, Mike I have seen these first hand and like I said I have worked on two of them. JL, I have also worked on the MCI's with the 12V's in them I know the difference. When I talked to the owners too of them did not have any info but one of them said the engine was put in some where in Canada, as to grayhound having any at that time I don't know,only saw the 8V71's when they were hounds, but then I have not seen every bus out there. Mike there's a lot of room in the back of these things.

Don

luvrbus

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2008, 04:49:56 PM »
Don, I saw one with a v 12-71 at Laughlin not long ago with CA plates and one with a 3408V Cat a monster of a engine and still had plenty of room

Offline TomC

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Re: Motor cooling on a Scenicrusier
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2008, 04:57:26 PM »
Nothin quite like the sound of a twin turbo 12V-71 with straight pipes!!.  But in this day and age of $5 fuel, I can think of a few alternates to the twin turbo 12V-71 that would put out the same power but get at least twice the fuel mileage.  Still- the 12V-71 does sound cool.  Good Luck, TomC
Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.