Smoking. Cracked ring...??? What to do

[artvonne]

  First off, until all of this came up I was a bit more ignorant than I am right now. Had it been me, two weeksago, I would most likely have found my way into the same deal Marc had. I dont know as I would have been able to sit still 9 days watching work come through ahead of me without going berzerk, but still. $1200 and on my way, again, the shop had a stellar reputation, not a ton of money, lets burn some road...

  I probably would have come a bit unglued when I came back and they told me the engines junk, after taking $1200 of my hard earned money to fix it, and send me down the road without saying it was junk to begin with. But they worked on it some more and im back with Marc again.

  I was also alongside for the tow, fully believing that Williams was really going to step up to the plate and take care of business. However, when they said no fuel in the oil, I might have just pulled the plug right there and then. You can only betray trust so many times.

  Running a bad engine home? Taking chances? Well, I dont know about you, but I thank the Lord every day I open my eyes again. Ive almost been killed more times than I can count, and always something where something made me turn and see it coming at the last second. So there is enough risk just to breathing to keep a man excited. Why worry about things you cant control?

  They overhauled a big Continental in a Beech Debonair, basically a V tail Bonanza (kind Buddy Holly was in) with a straight tail. Bob did all the engine work but the crank was sent out to an aircraft crank shop. Continental cranks have lead plugs they smash in the holes to plug the oil galleys.

  So we got it all back together, new prop, yada yada, we done a lot of work on that girl. Time to take her up and fly for the one hour flight you do on a new engine before you return it to service. Man what a blast, she flew sweet, motor ran "perfect", cept for slightly low oil pressure. Next day Bob ran her up to warm it, then shimmed the relief valve to punch up the pressure a few pounds. Fired her up, let her warm while he cycled the prop, then poured the coal to her. I wasnt there, but by all accounts it never reached full power before it suddenly went quiet. Bob said he never saw an engine stop so fast. Three guys couldnt turn the prop after, it was froze solid. Diagnosis: a lead plug came out, instant siezure.

  So I flew in an airplane with a brand new engine for one hour, that had maybe 5 minutes of life left in it when we set her down on Gods green pasture. When I think of where we flew that day, over lakes, some places we flew rather low, well, you better laugh cause it will scare the hell out you if you dont. Its not unheard of for an engine to rip itself right out of a plane when it locks up. So I think about stuff like that when im flying down the highway watching the little white lines blow under the nose and thread out behind me through the mirror. The tractor that almost pushed my into a huge fire pit while I had my back to it, and a voice that said "look". The giant implement tire that came off a semi on the freeway, went a hundred feet in the air, and bounced off the road 4 feet in front of a blond in a VW. She never saw it, just drove along like nothing happened. The time we drifted toward a dam and the engine engine wouldnt start.

  So I just dont think ill worry to much about an old Detroit bangin away in the back trying to die, ill just plan my way of escape better.

  

[thejumpsuitman]

Wow, you've had some close calls alright.  Glad you're still with us! 

I guess the important thing in any situation is to have a "plan B".  What I mean is know in advance what you will do in case of an emergency.  What plan B is to you might be different than what mine is, but I think in life, you have to have one for everything.  Otherwise, when disaster strikes, you run around like a chicken with it's head cut off.  At least with a "Plan B", you already know what you are going to do and how to proceed.

On the Williams situation, it's not over yet.  I still hold out hope for an overall positive outcome.  And I will reserve my own personal judgement of the company until I am completely done with the deal.

I can't really second guess myself because the more I think about it the more I realize that I would have done the exact same thing again if I didn't already know what the outcome would be (and we never do).

[Highway Yacht]

Marc??? Whens the Beauty going to makes its way into North Carolina?? Need any help getting to Atlanta or someone to follow you back??

Jimmy

[JohnEd]

Brian,

I couldn't be in more sympathy with what you are saying.  I take full issue with it costing $400/day to coordinate the availability of three people on site.  That is 120% overhead with no plant assets or even a facility.  I think you are being a trifle overly sympathetic in that regard.  But, again, I agree with you about the cost of doing business.  I have never begrudged a man his earned pay or other compensation and when possible I have been generous and even added money to the bill in good conscience.  Nothing in this post shouldn't be understood in that light even if I misspoke in some instance.

I once had to task into a Gummint Agency to have some software engineering and other computer services done.  When I got their estimate I was flabbergasted that their labor rate was $400/hr.  400!  Of course we had to talk about that before I would authorize the funding.  Turns out that the powers that be had consolidated a weapons depot that handles nuclear weapons and had had a new railroad system installed, including two locomotives, with the engineering facility.  Weapons don't get any funding from anybody but the shooters and the cost to support the depot was breaking some funding backs.  To spread the "burden" they annexed a few other facilities into the pot and spread the load over a broader spectrum of Gummint projects.  Dirty pool?  Maybe.  I thought so and I resent hiding charges and deferring costs.  BUT that was the game being played so we all had no choice.  That was the best money I ever invested and the products I got from them shook the earth....by the way.

John

It costs a lot of money to have a man who is an employee in a well equipped shop who is supporting a family and expects to have a good standard of living do work for you.  If you think a good wage is $30 an hour (I don't, personally, but I don't know what a journeyman mechanic expects to make these days), expect the shop to have to charge 4 times that to cover the overhead, the space, insurance, power, tooling, profit for the owner...  it's just how it goes.  A normal person just can't afford much in a pro shop these days.  I recently had my eyes opened very wide, accompanied by a panic attack - my wife's mother fell and did soft tissue damage to her knee - a lot of pain, can't walk, and is too weak to be able to self transfer to a wheel chair or anything like that.  she lives in a Retirement Villa sort of place, the rent is already $3K a month.  We had to have an around the clock "personal support worker" to assist, which are tremendous people but the lowest possible tier of care workers making little more than minimum wage.  $25 per hour to the agency, 24 hours a day = $600 a day or $4200 a week, or $18,000 if I had the serious misfortune to have to have need for that for a month...

Things just cost a lot these days if actual people are involved in the doing of them...


Brian

[JohnEd]

  While ether sounds plausible, running sweet for 500 miles and suddenly going Kaboom makes a guy think something more catastrophic happened.

 

It's scarier than that...  The injector did NOT come apart, they showed it to me.  And I drove it 800 miles without even a hint of trouble.  It all happened at once and completely without warning.
[/quote]



This makes so little sense.  If the piston threw a chunk and bent all four valves I think it is not possible that the injector head/nipple went unscathed.  Still, it couldn't have run so sweet with the bent valves and you did note a loss of power but no a dilution of fuel in the original failure episode.

[JohnEd]

There was definitely fuel in the oil.  I don't care what they try to say.  I watched it go from 2 quarts down to 2 quarts over in an hour.  It blotted the rag like water and smelled like diesel.

So Jumpsuit suspects roughly one gallon of fuel dilution in an hour?

I think the dilution was greater than a single gallon.  I have read many times that 15 W 40 is consumed at a faster rate than straight 40W.  The reason presented was that the thinner oil goes thru seals and past rings much easier.  Clifford said that a single gallon dilution should not have torched the bearings and I will take his word without question.  How much the oil was was diluted can be determined with a "specific Gravity" test of the oil and that is a simple test.  Not much math involved either.  Just gotta have a sample you are confident in.

[JohnEd]

John Ed,

The unsettling word in your post is the word "most". I am imagining that Marc is looking for the word "all". 
/quote]

Now see, that's what is meant by Pa. humor.  Understatement at the worst possible instance.  Its like asking if someone is dead and getting "mostly" as an answer.

[thejumpsuitman]

  While ether sounds plausible, running sweet for 500 miles and suddenly going Kaboom makes a guy think something more catastrophic happened.

 

It's scarier than that...  The injector did NOT come apart, they showed it to me.  And I drove it 800 miles without even a hint of trouble.  It all happened at once and completely without warning.

This makes so little sense.  If the piston threw a chunk and bent all four valves I think it is not possible that the injector head/nipple went unscathed.  Still, it couldn't have run so sweet with the bent valves and you did note a loss of power but no a dilution of fuel in the original failure episode.
[/quote]

I was surprised when I saw it intact.  The mechanic even said... "Even the tip is there."

I asked if I could have it, but there was a $61 core charge.

[artvonne]

It costs a lot of money to have a man who is an employee in a well equipped shop who is supporting a family and expects to have a good standard of living do work for you.  If you think a good wage is $30 an hour (I don't, personally, but I don't know what a journeyman mechanic expects to make these days),

Things just cost a lot these days if actual people are involved in the doing of them...


Brian

   If fuel really tops $5 and stays there, the merry go round is going to come to a screeching halt. No more new home construction, no more new appliances, no more shiney new cars. They can want $100 hour all they want, but if everyones out of work, they will be too.

[luvrbus]

I am really confused here are we talking about the first injector removed and replaced in Montgomery or the one removed in Atlanta when they pulled the head I am missing something here ?

[Van]

Clifford, I think the first injector took a dump?

[thejumpsuitman]

The only injector that was ever replaced was the one in Montgomery.  I saw it with my own two eyes and it was completely intact.  I asked for it, but it had a core return.  The only thing that seemed wrong with it was the lever was kind of loose.  The tip was there, all the guts were still in it.

[thejumpsuitman]

Marc??? Whens the Beauty going to makes its way into North Carolina?? Need any help getting to Atlanta or someone to follow you back??

Jimmy

LOL.  I wish I knew, Jimmy.  Thanks for the offer.  I might just take you up on it.

Marc

[luvrbus]

Should have got photos of that one I bet money there was a section missing on the tip or it would not have run some better after the repairs


good luck

[thejumpsuitman]

Should have got photos of that one I bet money there was a section missing on the tip or it would not have run some better after the repairs


good luck

Looking back on it, it had a miss when it first went bad, and it still had a miss when I got it back from them.  I only heard it run smooth once right after the third time they tried to give it back.  It smoked when I dropped it off and it still smoked when I picked it up.  I'm not sure that I could say it was running any better at all.  

The only difference is that it was smoking more at idle when I dropped it off.